THE FLAWED
DETAINEE CATCH & RELEASE POLICY
U.S. Army Master Sergeant John E. Hatley was sentenced (initially) to Life in prison for the alleged killing of four unidentified insurgents.
OIF -06-08 to Iraq was his 3rd deployment. John was only 6 months shy of retiring, having served his country for almost 20 years with an exemplary military track record and was highly decorated.
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[Yes. There is a book currently in the works.]
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Ladies and Gentlemen,
As reported on CNN: The military released 77,000 of about 87,000 detainees locked up during the Iraq war because there was not enough evidence to hold them.
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(From a combat peer that served with John Hatley……….)
Please read the compelling excerpt (below) from the clemency letter that First Sergeant Todd Carlsrud wrote where he discusses the DHAA (Detainee Holding Area Annex) in length. Note the frustration/complexity that soldiers experience with the DHAA:
[How do you fight the situation of getting shot and blown up on a daily basis and then be forced to release the man who killed one of your soldiers? You try to do the right thing and arrest the individuals responsible for these attacks, knowing they will kill another soldier tomorrow. How do you combat that threat?] – First Sergeant Todd Carlsrud / 172nd Brigade Combat Team
*To read compelling letter in it’s entirety, see “Letters from soldiers” or ”Case Details” in header at top of this page.*
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“KILLINGS AT THE CANAL – MURDER OR BATTLEFIELD JUSTICE”
See extensive coverage by CNN’s Anderson Cooper and CNN’s 1-hour Documentary on our story. Reporting by CNN’s Abbie Boudreau investigative reporter & Special Investigatives Unit Producer, Scott Zamost. (Aired Internationally back in Nov 2010): http://www.ac360.com or http://www.cnn.com See what CNN uncovered.
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“IMPRISONED FOR SAVING AMERICAN LIVES”
On (Monday) Feb 22, 2010
See David Horowitz’s “Front Page Magazine” with our story on the front cover, written by Mr. John Work: http://frontpagemag.com/2010/02/22/imprisoned-for-killing-terrorists-in-iraq-2/#idc-cover
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YOUR QUESTION:
WHAT CAN I DO TO HELP GET THE WORD OUT ABOUT THE FLAWED – DETAINEE CATCH & RELEASE POLICY AND ALSO PLEA FOR THE RELEASE OF ALL 3 AMERICAN HEROES; MSG John E. Hatley, SFC Joseph P. Mayo, SGT Michael Leahy Jr.?
ANSWER: Click on “Campaign for Clemency” in header of this page.
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WHAT ELSE CAN I DO?
ANSWER: Click on “Time Sensitive – Call to Action” in header of this page.
DEADLINE IS: FRIDAY, MARCH 12, 2010
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Feel free to leave comments below.
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Kim keep up the fight for John. I am from the Vietnam era so I know how all this works. If there is Justice in this World John will be Home. Hang Tough.
Death from above.
Somewhere is there a summary of the charges and proof of it? Is there sworn testimony?
I’m sure you have attacked it already, but was there any judicial review? What, if any, comments were made or added by the C.O.?
When did the acts John is accused of happen and when and were was the trial?
I’m a late arrival to these events, but am interested in helping, if possible.
Kim,
I am sorry for what is happening to John, You and your family. I want the war to be won, and the way you do that is break things and kill people. Unfortunately, the US Policy has been from the start to “Break things, but try not to kill anyone”. Early in the war, the planes and helicopters would allow crews to escape from tanks and other equipment, then destroy the equipment. That just allows the fighter to come back and fight with an IED, RPG or AK, another day. The Catch and Release policy is the same. To win a War, you must kill so many of the enemy, that they want to stop. That is how you win wars. Also there are not as many “Inocent Civilians” as were are being told about. In the US Military, we have Cooks, Doctors, Nurses, Supply Clercks..all are in the military and in uniform. Down Range the wives and childeren do these jobs, therefore they are “Enemy Combatants” and you must kill them all.
Hang in there, my prayers are with you.
Van
I´m a SGM DSO/SF for Nato and have now 25 TIS.
There are some questions we have to think of:
For what have we been trained? What is our mission? and who gives us our orders? We or they should think about this. I´ve been in many delicate missions. If somebody asks, we´ve never been there. We lost also soldiers, brothers and who cares? I agree, like others said, have those who judge them ever been in war/mission or have they served their country? NEVER! I´m not just fighting for my country, I fight with NATO and all his partners.
John became one of my best friends and he is an experienced and best NCO´s I know. I´m very thankful to know John and have him as a true friend and no matter what I would fight on his side.
Any time, any where, worldwide
God bless you, you are in my prayers
“Shit happens!” When will they ever learn….?
My heart goes out to all 3 men and their families. I will join your FB so I can keep up with things, and I will repost. My son is a Marine and I myself know how much service men and women give up to serve their country, and they do it willingly. Let us support them.
Now that’s a raw deal – he deserves a medal not a life time lock-up……..
With prayers the truth will out………
I have known Kim and John for several years. I served with the 18th Infantry in Vietnam and have visited the unit in Germany several times to support the troops during this current war. John is a fine man, soldier and husband/father. I respect his judgment as a leader under the stress of combat. What ever occurred during that operation needs to be fully investigated. I have experienced war and am familiar with the choices soldiers must make to safe-guard the lives of their troops. My prayers and moral support are with all of these men and theirs families. May justice be done.
Wes Geary Darkness19
this man stood up for all of us and we all now need to stand up for him!!!!!!!!!!! send this to everyone and contact officals to let them know we are not going to accept this kind of action toward a hero!
keep fighting and we are figthing we you!
you and your family are in our prayers
karle and betty maye
I have 5,000 ‘friends’ on my Facebook page . I am posting this and feel free to visit my page anytime to post news or appeal to my conservative friends . Please tell John that this former Canadian Sergeant feels immense sadness for this deplorable situation .
If you have a facebook page please post it, if not, please make one under causes then link back here.
We need to help your husband the best way that we can which is getting the public informed.
I am spreading the word. This outrage can not stand.
He defended us, we need to defend him.
He fought for us and we will damn sure fight for him now.
Bob
New York
Having been falsely charged, convicted sentenced and fired as an LAPD officer during the 1990s, I have an idea of what these good men and their families are now enduring. Fortunately for me, appellate courts reversed my conviction and cited the judge and prosecutor for misconduct. Although I suffered the loss of my marriage, financial hardship and bankruptcy, I was lucky compared to Sgt. Hatley and others who were similarly charged, convicted, sentenced and incarcerated.
Nevertheless, this was only a matter of time before those who criminally charged cops who do their jobs redirect their efforts to servicemen and women who risk their lives each day on behalf of the USA and the contries we now serve in.
War is ugly and mistakes are made in war. It is one thing to punish those who make mistakes and quite another to send them to prison after they have served honorably shocks the consiousness of America. If someone is deemed unfit to wear the uniform or to receive a deserved pension then do that. Incarceration, however, seems unusual and cruel – not just to those who endure that but also their families and the families of those who now serve and their supporters.
War may be hell, but punishing those who served seems much more tragic.
Clark Baker
USMC (1975-1981)
Mrs. Hatley,
Our hearts and prayers are with you, your husband and your family. Your husband is nothing short of a hero, doing what must be done so that sniveling cowards can second guess his methods. I challenge any man who has not served our country and experienced combat to shut up about this until they man up enough to go themselves. Your husband deserves a medal for doing what needed to be done. Many times what must be done is not the easy path and I thank God for men like your husband who are willing to do the terrible things that must be done to keep our country safe. Having spent 10 years in the Airborne Infantry myself, your husband’s character is obvious from the statements here by those who served with him. It’s sad to see some of these negative posts and I wonder why these people who hate America so much decide to stay here. Stay strong and know that many are praying for you.
agreed. great post!
thanks for all you do Kim. Wolfpack!
I agree we should never have sent soldiers over there. We could have taken care of things from the air or just let them alone to fight and kill each other.
The real enemy is right here in our country. What a time to have a Muslim President!
No Birth Certificate, seal records!
I meant to say SEALED RECORDS. WE KNOW NOTHING ABOUT THIS MAN AND HE IS OUR PRESIDENT. WHY DID HE SPEND OVER ONE MILLION $ TO FIGHT THE BIRTH ISSUE?
As a commissioned officer, I am not at liberty to say whether or not I agree or not agree with any commander-in-chief. Former Presidents Clinton, Bush, and now President Obama all fall (or have fallen) under this category.
With that said, I do not agree with your post. I’m not saying that we should have never sent Soldiers and Marines over to Iraq. We would have most likely deployed to Iraq in the near future anyway. We attempted to proactively deal with a threat and establish a democracy in a country that divides the two main Muslim Sects in the Arab world. With a stabble government, it would mitigate future threats from terrorism against our country. That is the bottom line, and few so many people seem to miss this point.
I do however believe that we went in there unprepared for an insurgency, and at the wrong time (with operations in Afghanistan). This has nearly broken our military and and diminished our chances of leaving successfully in a reasonable amount of time. We also pushed our troops to the point that we are unable to react to another foreign threat, gambling with a dangerous potential threat.
Secondly, you will never fight and win a conflict with drones and air strikes. It is impossible. Read a little on the history of warfare and counterinsurgency. The infantry will never be replaced and it is absolutely critical to have Soldier on the ground in order to fight and win battles, whether they are conventional or counterinsurgencies. The Infantry Soldier is the most important piece to all of this, everyone else just supports their operations.
Thirdy, if you believe that the enemy is our own country, then you should either proactively try to fix it or move out. I do not believe that the enemy is our own country, hence why I serve the government, their strategic interests of fighting terrorism, and most important, the people. For Soldiers, Sailors, Airmen, and Marines to be viewed in any other way is a travesty. I will hold back the rest of my words here. I signed my life away in order to protect this country. Our military is the policy executors, not the policy makers.
Finally, although our President is the son of a Muslim father, he is clearly a Christian. He has gone to church the majority of his life and was primarily raised by his mother on U.S. territory. He was since provided a Birth Certificate (whether or not it was sealed), and most importantly, our electoral system voted him in office.
If you don’t agree with who voted him in office, then I would advise you to vote those members out of office. The President is only the Executive Branch. The Legislative Branch of our government is the reason that we are in Iraq, all 97 out of 100 of our Senators in 2003. And oddly enough, then, Senator Obama was one of those three who did not vote for the war; do not forget that.
Although you may be a right-wing conservative, does not mean that I am. I appreciate your support for John Hatley, but do not attempt to make this a pro-conservative forum. This is a pro-American forum and we need everyone’s support. These are the real people that need our help, and we ought not to turn the average American away.
Thank you for supporting his cause.
Cheers.
I served 24 months directly working with MSG Hatley. He is the single most significantly important person in my mentorship and person that I looked up to while I was a newly commissioned officer. Through my experiences and through directly watching his actions, I can honestly say that he loved and cared about his Soldiers more than he cared about himself. He is directly responsible for bringing home every last one his Soldiers that made it through the chaos that we experienced alive. He is barnone most professional NCO that I have ever served with.
Thank you for what you are setting forth to do. By being a catalyst in overturning a flawed policy that the U.S. has put in place that has risked the lives of our Soldiers that were (and still are) defending our country and court martialed numerous heroes and patriots for actions in which the members of the board and prosecution had never experienced themselves, in a conflict that we received little support from our government with. We (the U.S. combat ground forces) were handed a steaming pile of crap and were asked to fix it with minimal support and guidance from our government. With policies, such as the aforementioned, in place, we are put in difficult situations, all of which we made to act in appropriately and decisively. We willingly volunteered to support and serve our government and defend our citizens and it irks me to feel that the government and its citizens do not support its Soldiers and their decisions in which they entrusted them to carry out.
Keep fighting and never give up our noble battle. You have more support than you will ever know.
Some of you may not like what I am about to say but then the truth is the truth. These people (Military) are our brothers, sisters, sons and daughters who were thrown into this war on a lie to begin with (remember the WMD that were never found). They were trained to fight and kill or be killed, they were not trained to be cops. How many of our kids have come back in coffins, and for what?? The only people who have benefited from this unjust war is the people making money on the military gear being used from the jet fighters to the ammo these guys used to stay alive. How can anyone who has never been in thier position judge them? John is a hero and deserves to be with his family.
I agree 1000%. We never should have wasted our Gladiators over in that shithole. Giving those people democracy is like polishing a turd, you don’t have much to work with.
They hijacked our airplanes and flew them into the twin towers, we should have just dropped the H-Bomb on them, end of story, and called it even.
It’s not like any people would have been killed or anything.
I totally agree with your statement…. I think we should have just dropped a nice one on them and ended it all.. we would have never been over there for as long as we were and wouldnt have lost all of the soldiers that we did…NOTE TO OBAMA, “Charity starts at home so dont screw up like Bush did and take care of whats ours”
1ST Sgt, stat tough for you and your family. As a former 1-18 veteran myself I know personally the Bull that we have to face on a daily basis in combat. I am a wounded warrior who supports you and your crew all the way. It is alright for these people that we have to go in and defend to kill our brothers and sisters in arms and display their battered and broken bodies like they are slabs of meat but we have to follow our ROE’s and treat them with absolute kindness. Don’t give up the fight TOP. Some of us here at home who know remember 09/11 and will never forget that they attacked us on our own soil and that we should have hit them with every bit of arsonal that we had at our disposal. The old saying that goes kill em all let God sort it out has no meaning here because they don’t beleive in God. Your family needs you at home and I wish that I had had the pleasure of serving by your side. It is sad that you are now a POW of our own country. For all of these people who are willing to judge us for what we do in the military, I say grow some, put on a uniform, grab a weapon and put yourself into the forfront of Hell as we have done in the infantry and then see what your view is of our heros that serve. I guarantee your mindset will change. First Sgt Hatley should be given a medal and have his so called charges deleted and either returned to duty with full combat honors and rank, all moneys due paid in full, and sent home to be with his family. He is a hero who gave of himself to defend the freedoms that we all enjoy and should be set free immediatly. This case is a travesty of justice.
AMEN Robert. I served in Desert Storm, Enduring Freedom, and Iraqi Freedom. First Sergeant John Hatley is a soldier I would be proud to serve with. I would welcome you in my door any day. Good luck TOP, and God Bless you. Hold your head up, and let the medals glisten off your chin as you hold it high. You deserve the opportunity to be remembered and looked up to as a VFW member in these United States.
I had the honor of visiting with John Hatley last Saturday along with Kim and one of John’s former COs. His attitude and demeanor was that of a professional soldier and true American patriot. I salute him as a Brother of the Band and embrace him as a loyal keeper of our Constitution.
I’m glad to see you taking an interest and doing what you can to help. True Americans like John Hatley need all the help they can get right now.
We sure don’t have any friends in the White House
Hi from Ireland, good post, deserves a Digg.
Dear Kim,
I do not know enough about your situation to judge anything but I am so grateful to your husband and son and others like them that serve so selflessly for our freedom. I do believe that most people would find it hard to understand without more information that is why I urge you or your husband to write a book. Fill it with as many facts as possible and that is the only way for people to know what is really happening. My prayer is that right will prevail. All my best, Dixie
Stay tough, TOP. The night before I was Commissioned in November, 1966, our 1st. Sgt. gave us all some great advice. He said “Listen to and take the advice of your 1st Sgt. Let him run your unit and do what needs to be done and you and your men will come home alive.”
When I got to my first assignment, as a young (19), green 2LT., my CO – an old LTC about to retire, had nothing but praise and admiration for his NCO team. In his words, “GOD never made anything finer than an NCO.”
Don’t let the bastards win, TOP. A lot of us old Soldiers are behind you. May God stay by your side and in your heart and watch over your family while you fight this battle. You and your family are, and will remain, in my prayers.
P. Steward,
Captain (former)
Combat Engineer
U.S. Army – 1966 – 1970
I know John from when he was a civilian in public school. He is a good boy and a good christian. He had to have weighed the consequences of this act and to have prayed about it before hand. I think God led him to his decision and pray that God will get him through it. I hope you have kept your faith. I know you will be free some day soon.
Wanda
To SSGBULL
In closing you said, “I really wonder about our leadership sometimes.”
I don’t wonder at all. I fully understand our leadership. It can be summed up in 4 words. They are:
THE JIG IS UP
I am hoping this damn mess with those 3 SEALs might help the cause by shedding some light on this stupidity.
I really wonder about our leadership sometimes.
Kim,
I want to let you know that there is not a day that goes by that we do not think of Michael, Joseph, you and John and the families. I want to say thank you for being so strong. You blow my mind away and Josh thinks the world of you and John. John was a father to my husband! Because of your husband, I got my husband home safe and so did many other mothers, wives, aunts, dads, brothers…… and I thank him every day of my life. We tried so hard to not read the comments after the CNN special. I have to understand that people are different. Tonight was the first night I read some of the comments. I’m blown away!
I know in my heart that they will all return home soon. I pray for it every day. We love you Kim and hope to hear from you soon!
What does Obama and Hillary have to say about this? BO probably would say let’s have a beer.
Hillary, secretary of state, is in a world of her own. Better to ask what Bill would do.
The government is a total cluster-#@!$%.
MSGT JOHN HATLEY, I am with you brother. I will keep you in my prayers and I know God is listening, He will not let you down nor will I brother. I have your back John. God Bless and Thank You Sir for your service to our nation. The American people will not let you down sir.
First of all I was never in the service because I was 4-F. With that out of the way I fail to understand why U.S. Army Master Sergeant John E. Hatley is in prison.
The purpose of war is to kill your enemies, is it not? It seems to me he did his job well.
To which I might add so what if they were civilians, women, or children. The terrorists who flew the airplanes into the twin towers were children at one time, were they not? They all had mothers, did they not?
In summation the American people as a whole are just too damm soft lead by that master wimp Prez Obama. He is a disgrace to all America has been and stood for in the past.
If we had a real leader like Teddy or Harry this so called war would have been over about 24 hours after it started and none of our troops would be over there getting shot at and killed.
In closing good luck to Sergeant Hatley and I hope it all works out.
I must say that it is upsetting to read so many of the rude comments made by uniformed, liberal, Cool Aid drinkers. Upset? Yes! Surprised? No! From an old-timers perspective (Viet Nam Combat Veteran from the same Regiment), I see 1SG Hatley as a true patriot, hero, leader, etc., but also a victim, fall-guy, goat, etc.. The real crime that was committed here is the conviction of these three men with zero evidence and only the testimony of a disgruntled wimp who probably is wishing he’d kept his trap shut. [He] got his fifteen minutes of fame on the CNN broadcast, but knowing Infantrymen like I do, he’d better look over his shoulder constantly and only move around at night like his type of snake does. Cunningham? Is that his name? What a poor excuse for an American! I have the feeling that these three soldiers will be exonerated and hopefully have their benefits restored. War is Hell, but actual combat is a “mother#&*$^*!”
Good luck with all that is thrown at you John. The free insurgents are a threat to any living human. If we can live in peace as two different cultures, then we win. I see no way of living side by side with these people. You deserve the freedom you have chosen to fight for.
I hope the next 30,000 soldiers are allowed to do the job we were sent to do from the start. You are an inspiration, and I hope the ignorance ends soon, allowing you the freedom you have earned as an American Soldier.
As a member of the VFW Post 1935, I salute you.
I have known John Hatley my entire career in the Army, I served in his unit for 8 years and have never met a more determined leader like him. He did what needed to be done in order to protect his men. It is part of the creed that we NCO’s live by!! How can someone judge him for his actions when they have never been in his position, to watch your men die and the culprits be released, constantly because of a technicality. This nation has become so politically correct that we treat our enemies with more respect than our soldiers. We need to get our priorities straight and fight for these men who made a hard choice under the stress of war in order to protect their men. I am worried for us as a nation when I see what we are becoming.
I know this seems to have settled down a little bit now since the airing on 360 CNN. Remember these heroes still have to think about what they have done for long time. I would hope that the ones that support them could send help to the wives and their families, every little bit helps, especially for the children that are involved, the Mayo family really looks like they are going to have hard time. Think about the families of these fallen heroes and stretch forth your support, this website is defend John Hatley not air your comments on the war and what your idiotic opinions are. Keep it real and realize the nation is at war and we have many soldiers suffering everyday at home and on the front lines. Keep all of them in your prayers and may God help all of those still in harms way and have safe keeping until they get home.
I am a totally disabled VietNam Vet of 62 years. I thought we would never see another VN, but we are….. and much, much worse than Nam ever was. Now, like then, we have shiny pant politicians, politically correct senior officers and a legal system that is politically motivated micro-managing this conflict. Lust for money and greed for power is the poison.
The examples of this are as plain as the nose on your face; The National Guard officer who fired his pistol into the clearing barrel to scare the prisoner into revealing info that saved 17 men from an ambush was tossed out of the Army. The Guard woman who was chastised for the Abu Gharab show… The over running of the base in Afgh. near the Paki. border because help never came, this John Hatley affair etc. etc.
Now, like in VN the commie bastards in DC won’t allow our men and women fight the war and get it over with…. wham bam and come home….
It won’t be long and all this country was, stood for and blood shed for, will be a thing of the past. I am heartsick for these brave men in prison and just as sick to see the country turn socialist and be controlled by an elite few. The economy is all but trashed, the president can’t make a decision on Afgh. for 3 months !! We have 30 million people out of work, 20 million that have lost homes, etc. There are terrorists groups all over the mainland US, more people are employed with the government than ever before, being controlled by food and employment.
The last big question is will our Military men and women turn against the American people when ordered to do so by the socialist government. !! When/If WE, THE PEOPLE fight to take back control of the country, will we fighting against each other, OR with each other… Sadly, I am not sure.
IF the American public sheds their yellow streak, reinstalls their backbone and forces the release of our John Hatley’s that are many, then there is a chance we can return to the Constitution of the United States and the Bill or Rights before we are completely dominated.
The clock is ticking !!
Broken Hearted American
God Bless You Sir…Iit couldn’t be said any better and I am ashamed of the way our government treats our brave men and women. We now have some 3 or 4 enlisted in the Navy that stand to lose their rank and face time in prison for “socking” a known terriorist. God forbid we “hurt” that sweet little guy, and God help us all. I feel we are on our way out.
Another Broken Hearted American
You have said it the way it is…..I only wished more people would stand up and do what many have been talking about….Stand up for what is right ….and stand up for those who protected our freedoms! May God have mercy on us and give us strength to overcome the evil that penetrates our blessed country.
I would like to personaly say I served with all of these men who are accused of this hanious crime. 1st SGT hatley is the best man I have ever known. We all remember the night it happened. The individuals that did die deserved it. For the ones who want to say stupid things. Imagine watching 2 of your best friends getting blown up right in front of your eyes. Then to arrest them and they get released you would have done the same thing. SO they are very justified….
SPC SMITH DUSITN, J
John and every other American soldier were trained and sent away from home and into a strange land to neutralize the threat of terror in the world. Like a real man ,John followed the calling of his country. As for any comments on how legal or illegal the war is can be sumed up in one statement.Any action taken to prevent another terrorist like 911 is legal. I appreciate men like John everyday for the sacrafices that they have made to perserve each and every priviledge that I have in these great UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.
I am outraged that our American Soldiers are less important than our enemies. They are trying to do a job with their hands tied behind their backs and this has to stop!! Let our soldiers do their jobs and get these men released!! I salute their bravery and would have done the same if I were in that position. My prayers are with all of the families and I hope they are reunited with their loved ones very soon.
God Bless You All
I have nothing to do with the army and have no connection to this case whatsoever, just a TV observer really. But I wanted to leave a post.
Sounds to me like U.S. commanders send soldiers to do police work, then punish them when they make a mistake.
I agree it is bad that these guys chose to take lives of 4 enemy combatants when they were already disarmed and I am sure it was against the army law, but courts should also consider the lives they saved before they made this mistake and – possibly, but of course not verifiably – lives they saved by in fact making the mistake.
I would set them free in a few years with lots of counseling while they are behind bars to rehabilitate them and no more army duty.
And commander in chief should think hard about whether it is worth keeping the army in Afganistan and Iraq. If they want to fight a war, send the army. If they want to help build another nation, send international peacekeepers or some other police force but not the army.
The U.S. Soldier, Sailor, Marine and Airman share a unique and frighning life style. We make the choice to serve our country for the better of it and its policies. We watch as our own citizens burn our flag, discrase military funerals and accuse us of all the atrocities comitted by the vast minority.
I see a lot of posts here claiming these men to be heroes, villians and everything in between. Take a minute before your next post and think about something, fear, anger, hatred, depression, lonliness and countless other emotions run through our minds every minute of every day in combat. The only thing that we can cling to for sanity is we are not like “them”.
Guilt or innocence is no longer relevant in this case. These men were found guilty, they were given a sentence and it is being carried out.
Is John Hatley a hero? I wouldnt know, I never met the man. Is he a villian? I wouldn’t know, I was not there that day. All I know is I have to keep faith in the fact that my fellow brothers in arms will keep me alive to go home and se my family when my deployment is over. If they comprimise the values that we cling to then they not only shame themselves, the U.S. Army, our great nation, but they shame the sacrifice so many other Soldiers, Sailors, Marines and Airmen made to protect those values that make us “not like them”.
Maybe you should go fight John. You have alot of nerve sitting in you nice comfy house not worried if you will ever see your family again. People like you make me sick. We should load up all of the people like you and drop you off over in Iraq and Afganistan and let you see how well you could survive.
Freedom has a special flavor that the protected will never know…. I really hope John is able to get cleared from all this. God Bless Our Troops!!!!!
p.s. If you don’t feel like standing behind our troops, feel free to stand in front of them.
1SGT John Hatley is the most brave and honorable man i could ever imagine, he has served 19.5 years for everyone in this country and the sad thing is it is so very little appreciated. Anyone who has not served has no clue whats going on, as a little girl i remember only getting to see him maybe every three years (if i was lucky) i also remember him coming home with holes in the bottoms of his feet and without complaint super gluing them back together. I couldn’t imagine what these men have to go through everyday and these ignorant people that have no idea want to say he’s no hero? Your kidding right? Someone who doesnt sleep for days while you complain about not getting to sleep in, someone who doesnt see thier family on a daily basis, someone who doesnt get to enjoy a cup of coffee in the morning, and someone who does get shot at everyday and puts thier life on the line for…YOU!!! I want to thank everyone who has been supportaive of my Unlce John and a special thanks to my Aunt Kim Hatley who has done a great job at getting this information out there! And for the other people that only have negitive and stupidity coming out of thier mouths are probably the idiots who complain about getting up in the morning and doing nothing with thier lifes!!! I pray for these people that God will be with them. Maybe they should move to the enemys country, i mean thats who thier supporting anyway! These men were doing what they knew was right and its sad that the people he was willing to die for our now saying he deserves prision and even death..i feel sorry for you people because we have God on our side and if i was in your shoes theres no doubt i would be scared!
I agree Kelsey! More young adults like yourself need to step up to the plate and have a voice…..Your uncle has been a beacon light for Freedom, the last 20 years….I am grateful and thankful!
What’s the problem here?? These men should not have ever spent one hour in jail! They were sent over to kill the bad guy-they did…end of story!!! How can you send people to war, tell them to kill the enemy and then sentence them to prison for doing their job?!?! This is a bunch of bullshit in my opinion!! SET THEM FREE!!!
well, here is something JUST for you JR: taken from a website….which is at the bottom of this information
News Middle East Iraq
——————————————————————————–
Thursday, December 11, 2008
US military rushes to build cases against dangerous detainees
Beginning on January 1, all detentions would have to be based on evidence, and the US would have to prosecute prisoners in Iraqi courts or let them go.
“At the end of the day, if there’s not enough facts to justify a court case, then we’ll have to release,” said Brigadier General David Quantock, the commander of the US detention system in Iraq.
comment from peter (release so that they can kill the ones who captured them I bet)
The Americans have evidence against only “a few hundred” of the most dangerous detainees, Quantock said, leaving open the possibility that thousands could find themselves back on Iraq’s streets soon.
Lot of work
“We have a lot of work to do,” he said.
Part of the challenge stems from differences between the US and Iraqi legal systems. In the United States, forensic evidence is widely used in the courts. Not so in Iraq.
“We’ve got a number of guys right now that are covered in TNT [explosive residue]. However, that’s not admissible in Iraqi court,” Quantock said.
Peter’s comment_ OH WOW…SO HOW DO WE FIGHT A WAR….WHEN WE ARE UP AGAINST THIS?
“What wins the day in Iraqi courts today is two eyewitness statements or a confession.” The US is training Iraqi forensic specialists and pushing to make such evidence more acceptable in court.
Peter’s comment (tell me…the terrorists do not GO BY RULES…HOW CAN WE be successful and keep our military safe, when we have this going on? They have TNT all over them and you LET THEM GO! – PLEASE – HOW IGNORANT IS THIS? ARE THEY TRYING TO SEE HOW MANY AMERICAN SOLDIERS FACES THEY SEE SO THE CAN KILL AGAIN?)
Iraqi judges are slowly bending, but it is expected to take time before forensic evidence wins wide approval.
this was in Dec of 2008
US forces are holding around 16,500 detainees in all.
Recent trip
The largest facility, with some 12,900 prisoners, is at Camp Bucca near the city of Basra, some 544km southeast of Baghdad.
Iraq’s government will receive the names and other details of those in US custody so it can issue arrest warrants for some of them.
Quantock said he is confident that either the US or Iraqi government will muster enough evidence to keep many of the most dangerous individuals behind bars.
But releasing the other 11,000 prisoners, who are not considered a serious threat, also poses a challenge.
comment from peter (oh yeah – the other 11,000 will be right back on the streets – killing again—-
The security agreement before Iraq’s parliament stipulates that detainees be let go “in a safe and orderly manner”.
US and Iraqi officials are mindful of the dangers posed by dumping thousands of suspected insurgents, even if minor players, into communities already grappling with high unemployment.
Peter’s comment – (Lets get educated AMerica….the 3 heros that are our AMERICANS are in prision for doing the RIGHT THING AND not doing the POLITICAL THING- WAKE UP!)
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These four Iraqi terrorist were killed because they were trying and maybe have previously succeeded in killing people. And everyone is saying that it was wrong to have killed these men without evidence, and is saying that these soldiers deserve to be prosecuted. I say that is all bullshit and the American public are hypocrites.
If these Iraqi men were detained, according to the law, and then released, just to later on bomb the SAME platoon who detained them, killing many young soldiers, everyone would be upset by it. And everyone would be having a different reaction to it.
When the american public hears about American soldiers being killed, they get upset and get all patriotic, but when they hear about American soldiers killing, they start criticizing. I dont think people realize that these are soldiers, not ordinary civilians, they are trained to kill and BE KILLED. When they are killed, everyone sympathizes, but when they kill, everyone has a negative comment.
Thank you. Until one walks in their shoes and was one of the 13 that was there – we have no right to judge. Would we rather have had those 13 commit suicide? The fight to live is strong for some and not for others.
God bless our troops and may they not be faced with the same predicament that will cause them to lose their stripes, their years of serving, and their lifetime income as a retiree.
You cannot murder someone based upon what they might do. These soldiers went rogue and are being punished justly.
Court said, “If I were Sgt. Cunningham, I’d be worried that, having broken the band of brothers, something might happen to me.”
Quoted from CNN by Hatley’s attorney David Court on Jess Cunningham reporting the incident to officials. Sounds like a threat to me. Or attempting to obstruct JUSTICE at a minimum.
Agreed! Watch your back. Your brothers died for you in vain Cunningham. I would die for mine, they for me. Cunningham you are alone and without honor.
U support your husbands and all of our soldiers 1,000%. I can ot understand why this is even an issue!!! We are at war, them against us and need to protect our soldiers and stand beside them. I see on the news every night what those savages are doing to our soldiers. YOU HAVE MY SUPPORT!!! God Bless You and Your Husbands
the usa is in an illegal war in iraq and these men murdered men. they broke the law, they are not heroes they are criminals.
what would you do if an invading army accused the usa of blowing up their buildings and having WMD when we didn’t do either? then they invade us, kill our neighbors and our families….?
would you shoot at the invaders? then they capture you and shoot you in the head instead of following army procedure because “it’s easier”!
nice!
we need to stop pretending that the usa is there for legitimate reasons.
we are the terrorists!
wake up,
your husbands were put in a tough situation but they CHOSE to sign up for it!!!
what a world! we believe we are righteous and we murder in that name and we lie to ourselves and the world.
disgusted in boston
You speak as if these soldiers have the power to dictate foreign policy, or even have a say in how the DHAA procedures work. They signed up for a variety of reasons, and it is not our place to presume to know their motivations.
You also speak as if you are certain that the thousands of insurgents our troops have profiled, captured and processed are innocent “upstanding Iraqi citizens”, wrongly captured and accused.
Go live a day in the life of an American soldier before you judge them.
Robert must move his sorry ass out of this country. If you voted your the problem. Did you vote? Then your the problem.
We live in America with some rights. We are protected by freedoms. We fight for these. Now move out of my Home land.
I understand soldier has stesses. Sometimes there are choices that are made. Some good some bad. We live with them.
If you don’t stand for your country move your ass out.
I praise the Troops. I pray for they’re safe return.
Disgusted by Robert
An illegal war Robert? How the hell is this an illegal war? We declared war in Iraq and are currently fighting an insurgency there too cowardly to stand up and fight us traditionally but willing to take the lives of hundreds of innocent people if there is a possibility of killing one soldier. Here’s a good question: Have you EVER been in a combat situation? I assume you haven’t because the only people that say these types of things are the people too cowardly to fight for freedom and their beliefs and for all the assholes that make these types of comments. I spent 15 months in Iraq in ‘05 and ‘06 in Fallujah and Ramadi and I’m going to tell you that you have no idea how stressful real combat is and how painful our government and people like you are making it for us. We fight in the streets every day, most of the time losing more than we gain because of our ridiculous rules and guidelines that allow for them to be the aggressors. You have no idea the stress and anguish that all of these men were dealing with. If 70 years ago, our government and the citizens of this country were as weak minded, peace oriented and cowardly as they are today, we’d be Japanese or German. What these men did or didn’t do in that combat situation is irrelavant. If they did not do it, they shouldn’t be in prison. If they did do it, they eliminated an enemy combatant and probably saved American lives in the process. If you have a problem with how our soldiers operate, go over to Iraq and police them. I’m not opting for the overused phrase “If you don’t stand in front of them, stand behind them”. I’m simply saying, go police our soldiers. Make sure they are doing the right thing. I’m sure the Iraqi people would love to have you there and would treat you exceptionally well. You’d be dead within 6 hours but you’d sure as hell understand that the people that we are dealing with over there, and you’re defending, are definitely not innocent people. The reason we still stand is because our men and women in uniform and the government and people that stood behind them, had the intestinal fortitude to do whatever it took to persevere and win the war. Our men and women in uniform still have that. Our government and most citizens however, do not. This is why we have not been successful in most conflicts, dating back to Vietnam, and this is why one day, we will fall to a malicious and irrefutably more defiant nation. God bless John Hatley, his soldiers and every other soldier willing to fight for what they believe in. I wish John and his family the best of luck as they deal with this cowardly government and people like Robert.
“If you don’t stand behind them, stand in front of them” rather
I sit here and read what yall have wrote some good some bad. There are days when i read stuff like this I actually wonder before you click that submit button do you read over what you have written and thought about what you have written? Cause maybe a few need to do this.
I am honestly ashamed at how these 3 were treated there is not a court stateside that would of convicted these 3 with out more evidence. There are no bodies. Thats a big deal right there. Let alone the invesitgator coaching a confession out of these guys They should be ashamed..
These guys put there lives on the line for ever single american. How dare you sit there and have the right to judge anyone? Be glad there are soliders that protect you!
So when you wake up in the morning say thank you to these soliders that are willing to protect us.
I work on a Type A military installation,
if any one of those 4 had asked me what to do, or battaliaon or brigade, they would have been told what was the wrong thing to do.
But they were arrogant to ask and took the law into their own hands.
It was a vote. all agreed. two young soldier got scared with the idea of Prison.( scary yes ) They crack under the pressure of the threat. This created the affect. And there was Prison still for them.
If you agreed and then snitch, you deserve life also.
And for the Snitches
If you would of just shut your damn mouth you all would be FREE. No witnesses. No case. This is truth.
As the spouse of a service member about to deploy for the 5th time, my heart goes out to you and your family!!! I can’t even begin to imagine how this has impacted your family. I have always been afraid to ask my husband what he experienced during his deployments. My family supports you and yours and are praying for John, who is nothing less than a hero!
Due to the inability to edit, any time I referenced the killed Iraqis I mean the four* of them, not whatever other number I said.
Whether these men are heroes or murderers it doesn’t matter. The two words are not mutually exclusive. They could be both, either, or neither.
All of three of these soldiers knew the consequences for executing the three Iraqis. I guarantee these soldiers weighed the consequences of killing them, with the potential costs of keeping them alive. I do not believe soldiers think they are above the law.
These soldiers alone knew the entire situation. I do not. If the situation led them to the conclusion that executing the Iraqis was the best course of action, I commend them for being able to do it knowing the potential consequences. It takes a brave man to willingly break the law for the good of others. That is sacrifice.
All soldiers sacrifice their time to serve in the military. Some soldiers make the ultimate sacrifice with their lives. All of them are commended as heroes who served their country. These three men knew the cost of their actions. The act was unquestionably illegal. And they sit in prison because of it. Committing this crime was their sacrifice, and I am grateful for it.
I can imagine situations where I would have done the same thing. We all have our own code of morals. Everything works great when our morals don’t conflict with the rules. But when they do, we face a choice: break the rules, or break our morals. Both have consequences.
Hey Gillam,
I agree with you, it’s not about soldering, it’s about common sense.
Hey WolfPac,
I agree with you – unless the so-called crime is not really a crime.
It used to be a crime to date a person with a different skin color than yourself or of the same gender. But just because some bureaucrat labeled it a crime doesn’t mean it really was.
These men shot these insurgents in defense of their lives. Not because they didn’t like them or they were owed money or a drug deal went bad. No, they shot them so that 24 hours later one of these insurgents wouldn’t get the chance to shoot them…
I honestly do not understand why so many people commenting on this site keep glazing over the fact that the insurgents that were shot were active combatants intent on killing American soldiers.
These are not civilian street punks stealing cars who deserve due process…this is an active combat zone and these guys have rocket launchers, machine guns, and hand grenades IN THEIR POSSESSION!
Get real people…if there is no procedure and/or POW camp that you can engage to stop these insurgents from attacking you tomorrow, then you MUST shoot them – you have no choice. And if you don’t shoot them, then you are stupid and deserve to get shot by them the next day – just like what happened to Tom Hanks character in “Saving Private Ryan” – he got killed by the very same German soldier he let go free earlier in the movie…
I get that most of you are not soldiers, but this is not about soldiering, it’s about common sense…
Richard
There is no way possible to prepare a man or woman for what they will encounter during war. God bless and guide all who serve to protect our freedom.
I’m sorry to hear what has happened to our soldiers. It would appear as though our government is trying to prosecute a war
like a civil case.
Don’t be fooled … we have lost the Iraq and Afghanistan wars.
The soldiers did their part but our incompetent civilian leadership failed once again.
I can only hope that once the press subsides that these men
will be quietly released.
For your information, the men that were killed were Shiite militia men. They were responsible for killing multiple Sunni civilians. In fact, on the day they were killed, they were hunting and trying to kill a Sunni family. A father, mother and young daughter.
This information is verifiable online and will likely be part of the CNN story throughout the week.
They did not live in this neighborhood. They were there for one reason, killing Sunnis and Americans. That is why nobody could identify the men.
Get real facts before you pass judgement!
Hey, if you can post a link to any of thie information, it would be GREATLY appreciated. Thanks, take care.
FACT: WE ARE AT WAR WITH TERRORIST
FACT: OUR MILITARY SENT OVER TO IRAQ FOR WAR ON TERRORIST
FACT: WAR USUALLY MEANS KILLING
FACT: OUR MILITARY TRAINED TO KILL TERRORIST
FACT: WITH WHAT THEY ARE GOING THROUGH…1ST SERGEANT HATLEY; SERGEANTS MAYO AND LEAHY WILL REMAIN HEROS IN MANY MANY HEARTS AROUND THIS NATION
BELOW: INFORMATION ON SUNNI’S BEING KILLED; BY TERRORIST; ETC FOUND ON http://WWW.CFR.ORG/
do some research and fact finding before you claim that our 3 sergeants are murderers;
Oh and notice what they say about the detention centers (run by terrorists!) Detention centers are the place where suspected terrrorist are suppose to be taken and held (but actually ….they are released, because it is a brotherhood thing….) so….any comments?
Introduction
There is a growing chorus of complaints from Sunni Arab leaders that the Iraqi Security Forces (ISF) has been infiltrated by Shiite militias that engage in torture, kidnappings, and, in some cases, deaths squads against Sunnis. Though Iraq’s leadership downplays these outbreaks of violence, experts say there is widespread evidence that an increasing number of members of the Mahdi Army, led by the hot-headed Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr, and Badr Organization are joining the ranks of Iraq’s military and engaging in paramilitary-style policing methods. “The ISF is not a true national force but rather a carved-up conglomeration of militias,” says Kenneth Katzman, senior Middle East analyst with the Congressional Research Service. The latest evidence: The November 13 discovery of a detention center in Baghdad allegedly run by Iraqi intelligence officials linked to the Badr Organization, where eighteen of the center’s roughly 170 captives—most of them Sunni Arabs—were reportedly beaten, blindfolded, or subjected to electric shocks.
Sunni Arab leaders accuse Interior Minister Bayan Jabr, a former high-ranking official with the Badr Organization, of turning a blind eye to this torture. The Muslim Scholars Association, a Sunni organization, recently compiled a list alleging hundreds of extrajudicial killings, disappearances, illegal raids, and instances of torture of Sunnis by individuals linked to Shiite militias. Experts say it’s impossible to tell what percent of the ISF is made up of militia members. However, according to the Los Angeles Times, the bulk of Baghdad’s largely Shiite 60,000-strong police force is split between those loyal to the Mahdi Army and the Badr Organization. Squad cars in Iraq’s capital often carry a green ribbon, the Badr Organization’s insignia, or a picture in their windows of al-Sadr.
I can only hope that once the press subsides that these men
will be quietly released, is the phrase that explains it all. The root of all evil is the media that preys on our men and women, in hopes of the big story that makes them famous, if not just for their fifteen minutes of fame.
The media and a very small hand full of soldiers that confuse conscience with protecting freedom have been a sore spot from the beginning.
John Hatley would be welcome in my home any day. To honor him as a Veteran of Foreign Wars is what needs to be done.
Do not take away what he has already earned because of the views of the ignorant people that have no clue what a hard decision is.
The next time you look out the window and the person you see is not looking at you as an infidel, waiting to kill you in exchange for 72 virgins, or the children walking your streets are not wrapped in explosives willing to do harm to you, you can thank all the men who have made the same decision John Hatley made.
If you do not have the courage or ability to fight for our freedom, then enjoy it by living your own life. Let the soldiers do their part. Whatever their part is, it will make this country a better place because of them.
Enjoy the holidays as each of you travel the United States, and be thankful that the trash you pass by on our highways is not an IED laid by the enemy. From on soldier to another.
God Bless you John Hatley.
Crime is a crime, and illegal is illegal, with that said, it means it is what it is. Now lets say if these soldiers were restrained and executed and they were your loves ones you would be up in arms and wanted the people who did it put to death if not in prison for the rest of their lives. It’s easy to sit back and judge when it’s not your family member who was murder needlessly. knowing that the people who killed them was slap on the wrist and let go. Life is all about choices we all make good ones and bad ones and we hope that we learn from the bad ones as well as the good ones. GOD BLESS AMERICA
Wolfpac,
no one came forwand to identify the insurgents. They’re loved ones should be crying out. Who’s crying foul?
Poor justice for justice. I hope there time is quick.
Hey Daniel Lim (Air Force officer),
When the Air force bombs buildings with suspected insurgents inside, they do so from far away without anyone shooting at them during the bombing.
For all practical purposes, please explain to me the difference between the Air Force bombing the crap out of targets where they know insurgents live and these four US soldiers shooting active insurgents that they had no way to detain?
Honestly, I beg you to actually think for a moment and let go of all the Geneva Convention BS and answer my question to the best of your ability…
1. The Air Force does not know for a fact that the people it bombs will try to kill Americans. But it is very likely.
2. The Air Force bombs them even though they are not under direct attack, correct?
3. Using the reasoning you cited below, the Air Force clearly engages in preemptive “murder”, correct?
If these four soldiers are guilty of murder, then so are we all.
If an Air Force pilot can drop bombs on insurgents while they’re sleeping in their camps and not be put on trial for “murder” then why the heck were these men hung out to dry?
Expand your perspective, and you will quickly recognize the abject hypocrisy of punishing these men for simply defending themselves and their fellow soldiers…
Richard Gillam
you’re what we used to call a “latrine lawyer”….always full of nonsense,and always wrong……
I have only one point to make. Does anyone find it a tad bit ironic that these soldiers went before a military tribunal but Khalid Sheikh Mohammad and his cronies will go before a jury of “OUR PEERS”? This whole thing reeks of our current administration. Gotta love change!!!
The army doesn’t prepare soilders for everything they encounter. I can’t imagine the emotional stress of war. Men and Women go into a war and kill. That is what war is. Some go home with medals and others go to prison. It doesn’t make sense. Our own goverment detained innocent people out of fear after 9/11. I assume that these soilders did what they did out of fear. I am sorry they have been taken from there families. I don’t know what happened or all of the evidence. I do know that there is nothing easy about war. We send our men and women over there to go to war and we expect them to do so under a guide? I think they could have used some therapy, not prison time.
John and the others are heroes, and thank god for them. This is disgracfful what has happened to them, keep the faith, I am praying for your family.
I was part of the 1/18 mortar platoon during that deployment, and I know 1SG Hatley is a great man and and excellent NCO. I wasn’t present when this incident occured, and most likely neither were you. It makes me sick to my stomach that people who have never been in his position, or anything remotely like it, can so blithely pass judgment.
Even if these allegations are true, it is incoherent to judge war-time actions by civilian standards. It would do everyone good to step back and remember that you were not there, 1SG Hatley was. He made his decisions, whatever they were, based on the facts on the ground. I know the kind of leader he is, and he deserves, he has EARNED the benefit of the doubt.
My heart goes out to him and his family, and I hope that justice will be served, and he will be a free man again.
Unbelievable! The Army has a Code of Conduct that prohibits the acts these soldiers were convicted of doing. It is no defense that they were concerned that the four Iraqi men would go out and commit more harm, it was not in their authority to decide these men should be killed rather than let them go. Think about what would happen if this scenario occurred here with police officers. Every day, violent criminals are let out of jail, with the police knowing that they are just going to commit more crimes. If a cop took it upon himself to “protect” his fellow cops by executing those criminals, he woul dbe in prison for life, adn deservedly so. We do not enforce the law by breaking the law. If those four men had been killed while attacking us, then those soldiers would be heroes. Killing them like a Mafia execution was nothing more than murder. How heoric was it to kill restrained and unarmed men. They coul dhave done any number of other things, interrogate them to find out where there cache of weapons was, turn them over to Iraqi forces, follow them home and then recapture them in the act. The phrase death before dishonor means WE would die before we brought shame on the uniform. They at least did not have to die. They played their hand, now they must accept the punishment.
I can’t wait for the movie! BTW Did they receive DISHONORABLE discharges?
Hatley Family,
It is sad to see how the government has handled this case and turned their backs on our soldiers.
Thank you for everything that your family has been through and sacrificed for this country. Your family is in my prayers as you prepare for the appeal.
I’m sorry. These soldiers were put in a tough spot during this war of opportunity, but Americans do NOT act in this way. Our conduct and moral bearing is exactly what has separated us from evil regimes throughout our history. It’s tough being the “good guy” and playing by rules that our enemies blatantly disregard, but since when does America take the easy way out? Once we lose our moral compass of conduct, law and justice, we become just another bully nation. We would become what we despise, and in a sense, the terrorists would have won.
It’s also a shame more focus isn’t being placed on the criminal acts of the Bush administration who lied us into the damn thing in the first place. Afghanistan was a war given us. But Iraq was one we went out and selected ourselves.
And these three men, who by all accounts are otherwise honorable soldiers, got put into a bad situation because of it. A bad situation where they made a very bad decision.
Shameful and sad, all around.
I am totally agree with you, I feel very sorry for those soldiers because they were put in a bad situation but they made the wrong decision. Since when we decide who lives and who dies, that is why we have laws and that is why we are so different from other countries, because of our morals. We cannot take justice in our hands, immagine if every soldier or police will kill any suspect they find.
I’m embarassed to be an American reading some of these replies, people making blanket statements about Iraqi’s and Afghanis who OBVIOUSLY have just a basic understanding of our nation’s conflicts there. The same basic understanding that the previous administration demonstrated in their invasion of Iraq and afghanistan, that got us into the mess in the first place.
the reason why there was no forensic evidence is because John Hatley and two others DROVE the men away from the interrogation base and killed them in the west rasheed neighborhood . they left the bodies in a canal, destroying any potential evidence.
Its unsettling to me that people are so willing to side with men like Hatley simply because of the flag they fly, are you people really this blind?
I am an active duty Air Force officer. I have not yet been deployed, and consequently I have never had to face combat. I am not entirely unsympathetic to John Hatley’s motivations. I cannot begin to imagine the stress of combat or the frustration of watching the enemy be released by a detention center.
Having said that, what John Hatley did was both immoral and illegal. Executing an unarmed prisoner is a type of behavior that we expect from Al-Qaeda or Nazi soldiers. It is not the type of behavior that we expect from an individual who freely chose to don the uniform of the United States of America. When Mr. Hatley took the oath of enlistment, he swore the following: “I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice.” Murdering an unarmed prisoner is a violation of military regulations. Our rules exist for a reason: to protect our nation’s honor and prevent us from sliding into the barbarism that we so despise in our enemies.
Think for a moment of what would happen if we allow soldiers to take the law into their own hands, to become judge, jury, and executioner for suspected insurgents. Our soldiers would begin murdering people on the basis of mere suspicion. They would kill both the innocent and the guilty. Our nation would become a nation that endorses execution without trial, and that is simply unacceptable. We all know the colossal ripple effect that Abu Ghraib produced. That incident became synonymous with American brutality, provoked mistrust in the Iraqi population, and has made the war on terror more difficult to prosecute. What John Hatley did was far worse, and incidents of this kind, if allowed to occur, would have a catastrophic effect on our propaganda campaign.
John Hatley must be punished harshly in order to serve as an example for others and deter such behavior in the future. The Army has justly shown that breaking the law is intolerable.
I am proud to be an American and proud to wear the uniform of my country. I am also proud that we maintain the highest standards of honor and professionalism of any military force this world has ever seen. John Hatley’s actions are a rare deviation from this, and we must see to it that things stay that way.
Among your comments; you also need to recognize the fact (brought up by CNN) that Cunningham (WITNESS against our 3 soldiers) was fixing to be brought up on some sort of charges himself. He was fixing to be prosecuted! Instead, with the “story” he brought out….he saved himself…now he is a free man. HMMM makes me wonder….Cunningham is cunning…no doubt….and he will have to live with his misconception of WAR and the fact that his misconception is destroying innocent lives; lives that were put on the line for ME…US…here in the great USA! If you are a true Christian and Patriot- you need to take a stand against such tyranny….
“If you are a true Christian and Patriot- you need to take a stand against such tyranny”
Are you serious?
Let me enlighten you to a little thing we as Noncommissioned Officers like to refer to as our creed, stop reading if at any time you feel your christian and patriotic values are being offended …
No one is more professional than I. I am a Noncommissioned Officer, a leader of soldiers. As a Noncommissioned Officer, I realize that I am a member of a time honored corps, which is known as “The Backbone of the Army”. I am proud of the Corps of Noncommissioned Officers and will at all times conduct myself so as to bring credit upon the Corps, the Military Service and my country regardless of the situation in which I find myself. I will not use my grade or position to attain pleasure, profit, or personal safety.
Competence is my watchword. My two basic responsibilities will always be uppermost in my mind — accomplishment of my mission and the welfare of my soldiers. I will strive to remain technically and tactically proficient. I am aware of my role as a Noncommissioned Officer. I will fulfill my responsibilities inherent in that role. All soldiers are entitled to outstanding leadership; I will provide that leadership. I know my soldiers and I will always place their needs above my own. I will communicate consistently with my soldiers and never leave them uninformed. I will be fair and impartial when recommending both rewards and punishment.
Officers of my unit will have maximum time to accomplish their duties; they will not have to accomplish mine. I will earn their respect and confidence as well as that of my soldiers. I will be loyal to those with whom I serve; seniors, peers, and subordinates alike. I will exercise initiative by taking appropriate action in the absence of orders. I will not compromise my integrity, nor my moral courage. I will not forget, nor will I allow my comrades to forget that we are professionals, Noncommissioned Officers, leaders!
Questions?
I served two tours in Iraq, one as the NCOIC of a detention facility. I watched the detainees come in and go out, guilty and the not so guilty. I kept my bearing and professionalism when dealing with men who killed Soldiers and bragged about it. In the year and a half I worked in the prison I never allowed any detainee to be mistreated. I have absolutly no sympathy for a man that will do what these men did. It was the definition of cowardace and they are a discrace to the Corps of Noncommissioned Officers. I truly believe that they were let off easy. I firmly believe they should serve their sentences in an Iraqi prison under the guard of Iraqis.
There is nothing but circumstantial evidence and no bodies – congratulations – you just did what these soldiers are supposed to have done – sentence innocents to die – hope your proud of yourself!!!!
For all the non Americans who have posted:
These men deserve a medal of honor. We need a zero tolerance policy – you get caught just once playing the terrorist role we take your life, period. The few decent people in these countries would applaud. These men saved countless American lives by getting rid of the garbage some call Muslim “men”. If we had more brave men like this snuffing out these terrorist the world would be a much safer place for all. Isn’t that why we are over there? Lets be real most of the middle east adds nothing to humanity, why should humanity waste their time with these zeros.
Total insanity…just like the countries we are trying to help.
I applaud your Patriotic speech, Sir. Bravo! I am sure that you volunteered to go over… correct? I am sure that you are an outstanding citizen that dedicates his time to making this a better country by telling everyone how another country contributes nothing to this earth.
You are a proud American who is worth 100 while everyone one else in a different country is a Zero.
I was part of those men who saved lives but they weren’t only American. They were Muslim, Christian, Catholic, Buddhist, Hindu, Jewish and so on… I am proud of that but am fairly ashamed of people like you. People who think that they are the only ones who deserve to live a fruitful life.
I didn’t go overseas to experience the worst of the worst just so I could give people like you the freedom to be moronic.
I am truly hurt and ashamed of you and your ignorant ways.
Well put 1stANGdan! Some people DO believe they are the only ones that matter and have no interest in preserving any culture other than that of this screwed up country we live in.
Spoken like a true idiot. Are you suddenly God? You seem to think so because you’re placing value of human life. Who are you to say that people in the middle east add nothing to humanity? What have you added to humanity? You should look at yourself first before condmning millions of people.
I am a mother of an American soldier. I am a sister to a brother that served in the Vietnam War. I am a sister to a different brother that served in The Gulf War. I am an aunt to a U.S . Marine Veteran. I am also aunt to a nephew who is currently a Captain in the U.S. Air Force. I think we are way off track in our treatment to these American soldiers. They sacrificed precious time away from their loved ones to assure our rights, priviledges, security and FREEDOM. If we were away from our homes and the people we love ,doing what we were trained to do and the end result of our efforts ended with the return of the same culprits firing on us again and again, would we not do the same thing to assure our survival? I think we would. As a patriotic citizen of the United States, I beg the powers that be, PLEASE FREE THESE MEN TO GO HOME TO THEIR FAMILIES. We are fighting a war on terror, are we not? Weren’t these insurgents the enemy we sent these men away from their homes to defeat. American people, lets do our part here at home and let our government know we support these men and the many others still fighting the war on terror.
Please also remember that there are no bodies and only circumstantial evidence against these soldiers. So remember there are two sides to every story – but what your doing to these soldiers is what they “allegedly” did to the Iraqi’s – condemning them with no evidence. You just didn’t use a gun. Congratulations – I hope you feel good about yourself.
Just one more thing – John is easy to spell – is your name really Mohammad? Just wondering!
I do not condone cold-blooded murder, war or no war. This was premeditated. It was idiotically planned and carried out. Pure stupidity. I have no sympathy whatsoever. Life in prison with no chance of parole would be acceptable to me. And stop blabbering about “oh, you weren’t there” or “you don’t know what these guys go through.” If they can’t follow the rules, get the hell out!
I am, and always will be, an activist against the death penalty, or killing innocents, but I am not, and never will be a soldier. I don’t know what they go through but I’ve seen the pictures. I don’t know what it’s like to be neighbours with some guy who will strap a bomb to his chest and walk into the middle of a group of my fellow americans and pull the trigger – do you!!!!!! Stop the judgement!!! GOD! If you had a time machine?? would you go back to a point in time and pull out a gun and kill the guys who boarded the planes that slammed into the towers – I would!!!!!! and maybe soldiers who were sent there to end the chaos felt the same way — they were sent with a mindset to kill the enemy Please don’t condemn without the facts!
Hi Perez-
The army already decided these men were guilty. It doesn’t really matter what you or I think–the ARMY that you seem to love so much has decided that:
1) They are gulity.
2) They are murderers.
3) They certainly are not heroes.
Sorry pal, you can call us cowards all you want but a true coward is someone who lines people up in blindfolds and handcuffs and shoots them dead. There’s nothing heroic about that. Going by your logic of “they did what had ti be done”, I guess people in the middle east would consider the 9-11 hijackers heroes, right? They did what had to be done? Right?
The sad truth is, the vast majority of the people living “Over There” do think that the 911 terrorist are heroes.Mr. Hatley & the other 2 men are HEROES & should be pardoned & given their rank & all that it entitles back.
Ok so …
I sign up to serve my country and do anything they tell me to do to serve our people and protect our land..honorable
I stick it out, go through the hardest training imaginable and really work hard: pushing my mind and body to the very limits to be the best protector and defender of my country that I can be..honorable
I follow orders and leave my family behind to fight a war I have been instructed to fight ..honorable
I kill when told to kill and have to place human emotion on the back burner to be able to serve and protect my country..honorable
I see my friends blown away by the enemy every day while constantly fighting to stay alive..yet I still keep going..honorable
I kill four men that I KNOW are trying to kill me and everything I stand for..I kill them because I KNOW they are the enemy and if released will be back at it tomorrow trying to kill me again…HONORABLE!!!
I am sentenced to life in prison for protecting my country, the life of my family, the lives of my comrades, my own life.. DISHONORABLE!!!!!
It is so easy to judge someone while sitting on your couch with a laptop on you legs and the tv on in the background..watching other people fight so you can be free to get fat and judge… but until you walk in someones shoes..ESPECIALLY the shoes of a man fighting for YOU in a war he may or may not even believe in.. but is there because his country told him to go and he went unselfishly to serve his country…until you walk in those shoes.. NONE of us have any right whatsoever to judge him… shame on you all..
I walked home on Sept 11 covered in ash from head to toe..after watching WITH MY OWN EYES innocent people jump to their death from 50 floors up to not have to burn alive..then ran for my own life as huge skyscrapers fell around me… So THANK YOU Mr. Hatley… from the bottom of my heart! The rest of you need not forget why he was sent there in the first place!! These guys DID come in our home.. and they came here to kill!! And if everyone continues to sit around and act passive and feel sorry for THEM.. they will come BACK in our home and KILL AGAIN! WAKE UP!!
Right on – you tell them!!!!!!!!!
and yea GILLIAM..SAVING PRIVATE RYAN WAS A MOVIE..NOT EXACTLY REAL.
It is with great sadness that I reach out to the family of John Hatley. The trial of these men should never have happened in the first place, as they were simply defending their own lives and the lives of their fellow soldiers.
The system currently in place is to blame for the tragedy, not these soldiers or the insurgents. If I was in John Hatley’s position, I would have done exactly the same thing. It would not have been easy, but I would have unquestionably pulled the trigger in order to save American lives. Period.
I also cannot blame the “terrorists”. First off, the four men killed were not terrorists; they were enemy combatants in an ongoing “war”. Moreover, if I was an insurgent trying to kill American soldiers and I was captured and then released after only a few hours, then I would absolutely be back out trying to kill more American soldiers the very same day I was released….duh! So, neither the American soldiers nor the “insurgents” can be blamed for their actions – as both parties were simply behaving in a perfectly logical and reasonable manner, given their respective circumstances.
This tragedy is the fault of our leadership and policymakers. The insurgents have a job to do and cannot be blamed for trying to do it – they believe in their cause as we believe in ours. The four American soldiers also had a job to do – starting with saving their own lives and protecting those of their fellow soldiers. Anyone who objectively reviews the evidence will quickly conclude these soldiers killed four insurgents in self-defense. Perhaps that self-defense was slightly time shifted, but so is the dropping of bombs on locations that very likely have insurgents inside who will very likely try to kill Americans and who will very likely succeed – given the chance.
When the US Air Force bombs an insurgent stronghold and kills a few women and children along the way, we call it “collateral damage”. The insurgents getting bombed were not shooting at anyone at the moment they were getting attacked…yet everyone still understands that it was a good idea to preemptively kill these people anyway. So, why is it that when these four ground soldiers preemptively kill 4 active insurgents (who, without a doubt, would have been trying their very best to kill the American soldiers only a few hours later) we call it “murder”? This is totally irrational. Moreover, these soldiers only killed enemy combatants and not any innocent bystanders, like so often happens in this war.
On another note, if we’re “at war” then we need to build massive POW camps just like in WW2 and hold enemy soldiers until the “war” is over. If we’re not at war, then why are US soldiers shooting at people and getting shot at?
As an American citizen who is eternally thankful for the warm blanket of freedom provided by our men and women in uniform, I am sickened and disgusted by what happened to these four brave American heroes. Why are they heroes? Because they did what they knew needed to be done, whereas the vast majority of us would not have had the courage to stomach the actions necessary for the defense of our own lives and those of others by shooting 4 people who would have undoubtedly killed more of my fellow Americans had they been set free. I regret the deaths of these four insurgents, but our soldiers were left with no reasonable alternative in the pursuit of an effective defense (of their own lives).
I applaud their actions, and I am honored by their sacrifice. But what of their families? Who is going to take care of them until our government can be convinced to release these unlawfully detained soldiers?
I weep for their wives and children, as should all my fellow Americans during this moment of insanity.
The mindless bureaucracy that set these events in motion is tearing at the very fabric of our nation’s relationship with our fighting men and women.
Richard Gillam
PS
Near the very end of the movie “Saving Private Ryan” Tom Hanks’ character is killed by a German soldier who had been previously captured. When the soldier was initially captured, the American soldiers had no way to hold him, so they had a choice to either kill him or trust that he would not rejoin the fighting and instead turn himself in when American reinforcements arrived sometime later. Most of the American soldiers suggested shooting him (not out of spite, but rather as the only logical option to prevent the German from killing more Americans in the future); however, Tom Hanks’ character vetoed this option, and instead trusted the German to honor his word not to reengage other American soldiers in fighting. This proved to be a big mistake, as ironically it was this very soldier who later shot & killed Tom Hanks’ character at the end of the movie (after breaking his promise and rejoining the fighting). Even more interesting, was that only moments after he killed Tom’s character, he was recaptured and, upon being recognized by one of the American soldiers, he was immediately shot and killed even though he was now unarmed and he was holding his hands above his head.
This unarmed, defenseless German soldier was killed by the American soldiers for no other reason than the fact that he had been previously captured and came back to try to kill more Americans anyway…in fact, he was in a lineup of a dozen captured German soldiers and was singled out of the group and then shot. In the theater where I watched this movie, the entire audience cheered loudly upon seeing the American soldier shoot the unarmed German. Thus, can we agree that it’s highly unlikely a LEGITIMATE jury would have convicted these four American soldiers simply for engaging in a logical and reasonable act of proactively defending themselves?
After seeing the video clip I cant say I agree with what any of these men did. If they were so guilty which I am not disputing at all then there are other ways to handle this type thing with out lineing them all up and shooting them. What else does one expect to happen? One has to remember that we are soliders and held to a higher standard then our enemies. We are not the judge and jury. When I was there buddies were getting killed 3-5 a month and we didnt line them up on a firing squad. I really think they got caught up in the moment of anger of getting hit everyday and losing some buddies. The Command and the army shares some of the blame for having nothing in place to help these guys out. Having said all of this I feel for the lives that have been ruined by this. In my heart I feel for these guys, but to say what they did is heroic? Is just crazy to me. It’s a simple moral decesion to make and they made the wrong one. day one in basic training they teach you to shoot unarmed anyone let alone flex cuffed and blind folded.
man…people in here are seriously funny, especially jon and amy…..I can almost guarantee that most of you making these negative comments dont even understand what its like to be in a situation like this. They are heroes, becuz they did what they had to. Some of the people on here make comments like,”Well it was a crime”…they seem not understand the environment of war. Honestly these people need to stay off this site, you guys are about the same cowards who probably would have let the guys go becuz you feel they are so innocent,but then in shock when you see that same guy standing over you with a barrel to your head…some people live in a fantasy world, matter fact these same people should be sent right in the middle of afghanistan, cuz all they would do is convert to islam cuz they would be to scared to speak up like they do here, cuz they kno theirs no freedom of speech with the taliban its a diff ball game…i would pay for their plane ticket
Please read my comment to fred below. Unlike the majority of you here, i actually do know what its like to be in a war. Do you?
Come on–these guys killed 4 men in cold blood. Why should we defend them? Taking people who are prisoners and murdering them is something Sadaam and his cronies did. It is not what we as Americans do. We are better than that. Or, at least, some of us are. You keep mentioning that your husband and the other two soldiers “allegedly” killed these men. It seems to me your husband claimed these men would “allegedly” try to shoot at his men. Sounds like your husband got the better end of the deal. He gets to sit in a comfy prison for a few years. The four men he murdered are dead forever. Maybe you can help their wives and children set up a web-site calling for your husband’s life as fair payment for their deaths? This site is ridiculous.
No matter what you think about the situation or the people, a crime is a crime. If you committed it with good conscious, well you need to pay for it.
How can you possibly say that he is a hero?? He is a murderer and deserves to spend the rest of his life in jail for what he did. If there wasn’t enough evidence to prosecute the three so-called terrorists, then they should have been let go. If something like this had happened in the US, you would be up in arms and demanding that the murderers be sent to jail. You and all the other racist hypocrites can defend the actions of a man that killed three other men based solely on where they come from, but i can’t. You should all be ashamed of yourselves. Nothing good comes from taking the law into your own hands. The US has always said that they want to create a better, democratic Afghanistan but where is the democracy in killing three men that the Americans had no proof did anything? In this case, these soldiers are just as bad as the terrorists. Killing to serve their own beliefs/ideologies.
I feel for you and your children but remember that people in the Middle East have families too and three of them are mourning also. One family can never be worth more than another, despite where they come from.
You don’t have a clue what you are talking about amy, with small a. have you ever been to a war zone? these man should be let go.
have you been to a war zone? I have, twice, and I still agree with Amy… wrong is wrong no matter where you are. By the way fred with a small f …
Actually i have. I was in the Bosnian war and i saw the killing of innocent people every day that i was there during that time. Please don’t tell me that i dont know how it feels because i do. I know what it’s like to have a father in a concentration camp starved, beaten and abused in ways that your mind can’t even begin to comprehend. I also know what it’s like to not know where your family is, if they’re alive and if you’ll live to see another day. I also know the difference between right and wrong. I have nothing against the army and as someone mentioned, they are heroes when they’re standing up for those whose lives they’re meant to protect and improve. When they take the law into their own hands, i dont care who you are, you should be sent to prison. Don’t you think i feel anger towards those that kicked me out of my country and made me, as an eight year old, see things that no other 8 year old should see?
So…fred with a small f, please respond to my comment once you’ve gone through what i’ve gone through and then we can talk.
Kim,
You and John mean the world to us. We will always be here for you and John will be home one day soon–I will continue to help you fight for that. You are both heros, as are SGT Mayo and SGT Leahy.
Please ignore the ignorant people on here who have not lived the military life you and I have and have not stood there and watched our husbands go off to fight and cry ourselves to sleep at night. Don’t let there rude, psycho-babble BS bring you down. I know you will be OK and continue to fight. You are the strongest person I have ever met and I am proud to call you and John my friends!
We love you!!
Kim, I love you and John, I also love Joe and Mike. Some of these comments are so damn rude, and I’m sorry. No one has the right to be saying these things, I am a proud disabled veteran. I am so blessed to have served with John, Joe, and Mike and all of 1-18. I miss everyone. For everyone that is disrespecting the wives of our nations heroes and all of us supporting our heroes, leave your comments to yourself unless your supporting em!!! Kim, we love you!!!!! We are always here for you!
EVERYONE PLEASE REMEMBER THIS IS FOR SUPPORT……..NOT FOR YOU TO BASH THE MILITARY. THE MILITARY THAT PROVIDED YOU THE ABILITY TO SAY WHAT YOU WANT!!! have some respect for the Hatley family…..
i sincerely doubt that had america not invaded iraq that we would not have freedom of speech today.
point is this site is for support, his family reads this. so saying he should be killed for what he did might be a little too much and hard for family members to read or for people who know john.
Go to hell. These people committed premeditated murder. That’s a crime, even if you think Muslims deserve to be killed.
John,
You are a liberal co#$ su@#$% that doesn’t deserve to breath the same air as our service men and women. Again, you represent someone that most people wouldn’t miss should you meet your demise. You, are most likely, someone who hasn’t and will never serve. You will never know the price of freedom because others have given it to you. Your mommy and daddy probably never taught you to think before your speak. You’re probably suckling on mama’s teat right now. Maybe they should have sat you down, explained honor, integrity, morals, value, and a little history as to why you are able to speak freely about your “opposition” of the Armed Forces. Most likely, they plopped you in front of the TV, threw some video games at you, and called you their “special little boy.” Yep, they most likely spent all their time hiding from you the fact that you’re actually a spoiled, ignorant, little dou@$ bag that should have been aborted before you tainted the human race with your first breath. That’s who you should be mad at. Take your frustrations out on them and spare the rest of us your idiotic babble…. You vile piece of sh!$.
BK,
The only thing truly clear in this situation is your ignorance. I’m guessing your youth is the culprit. (You’re probably not old enough to have had the opportunity to serve your county).
You, by no stretch of the imagination, could possibly understand the situation these men faced. They are Patriots and I know dozens like them. I wish the best to them and their families.
First of all,
I hope for the very best outcome for these three men. I agree with the SGT below there is an element of fear that some will never understand by being in the desert surrounded by those that want to kill you.
However as Americans we have to hold ourselves to higher standards than those around us. For those demanding that commenters that are voicing their upset-ness with the situation should pack their bags and leave the country, maybe you should instead. You’re doing this country a great disservice by implying that others are not entitled their first amendment right that these very same soldiers were sworn to protect. Theres thousands of Americans in the sandpits fighting everday and we can not break rank, break face or let them into our hearts/minds.
Every man and woman has to take responsibility for their actions and decisions. They understood the risk for the actions they took, trust me. If I murdered three Iraqis in the desert, I’m sure my General father would understand my fear, but would be moreso embarrassed if I didn’t stand on my own two and do the 10 years that they probably won’t stay in the whole time for.
God bless em’ and anyway you look at this, it’s not good. Best of luck SGTs.
I believe it will take some Politicians looking into this situation to make a difference. Maybe this is where our Political leaders can really show us what they are made of and who they represent. So many of them have lost the respect of the people in this new administration; who wanted Change….Our prayers; thoughts and more will be with these families during this trying time….Psalm 46:1
I will not give my opinion on whether these men are innocent or quilty because I don’t know all the facts however when I first heard this story I wondered what would have happened if someone had killed the men who boarded the four airplanes and drove them into the twins and the pentagon – just a few men caused thousands of deaths. Hmmm…. makes you wonder who is alive today because of their alleged actions.
Your point of view is shockingly open and unbaisly to the point! thank you for putting that out there
and this goes to bk…you need to shut up…..cuz i can almost guarantee your the same guy who be protesting a draft cuz he is too scared to fight. You’re worse than garbage.
It’s funny how you have some people saying that he had no right to kill those iraqis. What’s even more sad is when you have comments on here coming from people who say they are former veterans in the army and have a right to say that. I think the so called “vets” who say that are prob some pogues or in the rear with th gear soldiers who never served in a combat mos…ie infantry, and therefore isnt there main job to engage the enemy. Yea they prob got shot at a couple of times on the way to another base, but their main job wasnt to hunt down the enemy, so in my opinion they need to shut up , i dont care what rank they are. Only combat guys have a right to talk cuz they are their having to deal with the judgement of there superiors when things go wrong. Alot of people on here make comments and cant even fathom the pressure these guys go through when their actively being shot at and seeing friends being killed. All i gotta say read the book “LONE SURVIVOR”, it shows the pressure of making a life or death decision, and one was made in the cost of his buddies….but some americans would rather see soldiers killed then innocent iraqis, but thats war, any person who never been in that situation cant comprehend that…same with being a police officer, the public is more inclined to let a cop be killed then a criminal, when most criminals have been a nuisance to society since grammar school…but most police officers have been model citizens, but they would still rather see a officer killed…people who dont kno what they talkn about need to shut up.
All reason goes out the window when a bullet is coming your way, no matter how much you train or how good your moral judgements are at the time. War is War, War is hell. Spitting on fellow soldiers just tells the rest of us what kind of person you are.
I am so sorry to hear about this…..God is watching down on all of us…and he is with you too…so BE STRONG beautiful woman …My prayers are with you
John,
The people that were “murdered” will happily cut your head off, or you mother’s, or anyone else that does not believe in their laws.
But then you wouldn’t know anything about that kind of raw hate, would you? Why? because Soldiers like John Hatley do not hesitate to fight wars that we are told to fight without question. And to think I watch my friends die, get wounded and the mental burden we who make it out carry for sheeple like yourself, who judge the one’s who protect your right to say such ignorant and mean things with out any knowledge of what he did. Why don’t you try fighting with both hands tied behind your back?
This man gave his life to save the lives of his men. The ultimate sacrifice. You don’t know about the sniper attacks that stopped, we don’t know who’s life he saved, because no one else was killed. Is a hero not defined by the act of giving his life so that others may live? He has to live through his sacrifice.
Poetic justice for people like you is for all Soldiers and agencies who protect you to just stop what they are doing and let these terroists have a good time setting up IED’s on the road you use to go to work and set up in sniper hides to get you, you’ll be yelling where we were for you then. Just like 9/11.
Sheeple! Just like a sheep to judge the dogs that will give their last breath to protect you.
If you didn’t sit at the trial, you don’t know the facts. No one, except those with access to all evidence is qualified to pass judgment and express these extreme opinions. These men were placed in a difficult situation.
Observing a crime in your neighborhood, would you intervene and be like many Americans and simply watch while the crime proceeds for fear of being judged incorrectly?
At least honor these men for their years of service to our country and lets give them the benefit of a doubt in the appeal process.
The bottom line is that soldiers are trained to kill.
History shows that if you kill a few in a war, you may go to prison; kill thousands and you get studied while under “house arrest.”
Does anyone else see a problem with that?
Yea stop making things up please.
I have been there and I know the struggles faced by soldiers every day. To imprison these soldiers for war crimes is a terrible injustice.
thank you for being a solider and defending our country and our rights!!!
Communist GO HOME….YOU ARE NOT WELCOME HERE!
our soldiers are the heroes!
For those of you that think that its easy to make the right or wrong decision you werent in these mens shoes nor do you know what was going through their minds at that time. Unless your in that situation you dont know what it is like. Everyone has their opinion on this situation and this is mine. GOD BLESS you and your family.
FREEDOM ISNT FREE!!!!!
“Our soldiers suffer so much” is such a big cliche that really means nothing when you look at any muslim country attacked by the U.S.. The people suffer more and to them the U.S soldiers arel ike viruses. You call them terrorists but they are simply defending their homeland. Anyways, if i was in your position or your husbands position, i’d be feeling the same. Those people attacked me and would continue to attack me if i hadnt killed them. I’d feel the same if thats the case. But your husband had no evidence that they were “terrorists”. I don’t think he should have killed them.
John,
Quit whining? Are you serious? You probably hate the armed forces, because you are not man enough to roll with the “real men and women,” of this country.
Your husband committed a very serious war crime and deserves to be in prison. He has disgraced himself, the Army, and every solider who has served his/her country honorably. You can’t just execute four prisoners because you think that the holding center would just let them go. We are better than that. This is not coming from an anti-military, liberal person but from a pro-military, conservative, who is a 21 year veteran of the U.S. Army.
how do you he disgraced the army and every solider. if you read the posts soliders are greatful for him and support him. i agree with roland caulker!!
Oh really, give me a break Tony….No CONSERVATIVE believes made-up Media on TV….If you knew the facts you still would not agree…your liberal through and through…You believe in giving rights to Terrorists….and all the touchy; feely stuff…..YUK….what a wimp.
I hope and pray for the release of these three Soldiers. They did what they felt they needed to do to protect the other American Soldiers out there is a country with no morals or values in the least. Better to eliminate the enemy then fight him over and over with no end in site. We never should have gone there in the first place. SET THEM FREE!!!!!!!!
Judge not, that you may not be judged.
Kim
From the 150 of us that serve under John. They may have taken his rank, taken him from you and your son, and made an examply out of him. To all of us that served those long 17 months with a made that brighten up the room everytime he walked in. We will always call him First Sergeant. I will only hope to one day be as great of an Army 1SG with half the respect that your husband received, but did not demand out of his men.
To those whose are blinded by their own lack of knowledge,
You will never truely know the meaning of fear. You will truely never know what it means to live and be free. You strive everyday to call yourself an American. But you will never know what it means to live and work and trust your life to men and women, of all walks of life, who come together for a common purpose. To give you the rights to belittle and degrade those very people who have given everything for you. I pitty you and pray that someone higher one day enlightens you on your own flaws.
Still Proudly Serving the WOLFPACK,
Sgt. Louis M. Scharf
they disgraced everything about the army and the US there is to disgrace….we hanged germans and japanese after WW2 for precisely the same thing…these 3 make me sick;they are NOT heros,they’re not even respectable soldiers.
Well, then you can go back where you came from….WE AMERICANS DO NOT WANT YOU HERE!
jane….you don’t sound too bright—-southern,maybe? shrieking in all caps just makes you look even more foolish…
John,
Have a heart. Are you a part of the armed forces? I bet the answer is no. Until you put your life on the line for others or see your friends and colleages murdered by someone that has no regard for life, then you make the disrepectful comment you have posted out of ignorance. I have never served my country, but I thank God for the men and women that are put their life on the line to protect me and my family from people who want to rule the world a think their believes are what everyone should believe.
Think about it this way; if someone breaks into your house and you don’t call the police or do anything to prevent them from envading your space again. You will be considered as a easy target. They will continue to violate you, because they know you are not going to do anything about it.
I don’t know your husband so I couldn’t tell you if he’s a good man or not. But even good men can commit a crime.
Your husband and the other two did not follow protocol and because of that they got what they deserved. There are lines of rules to follow. Your husband did not follow them. He took the law into his own hands and now he’s right where he should be.
If I were to go and kill someone who has committed violent and atrocious acts, that doesn’t make me a hero. It makes me a murderer. And I would go to jail for killing someone. Your husband had no right taking the law into his own hands. For that, he now resides in a cell.
You can put spin on it to make it look he’s a “war hero”. But war heroes come home with medals on their chests. Where’s your husband? In jail. Jail is not a place for war heroes. Jail is a place for criminals.
it is nice of you to be able to share your feelings……what is that the first admendant?? wonder who fought for that? apparently not you! it was men and women who SACFRICE their time and familys time to protect our rights. next time you see a solider you should try the words “thank you”!!
Jon….If you would take time to read and research instead of relying on media mind turners….you would see that he is indeed a HERO…..with numerous medals; awards….Kim maybe you should put that back up on the website…and oh what was that 5 or 6 Good conduct medals among all his many others….there was like 100 I believe….hmmmm? The only thing missing is his medal of honor that he so rightly deserves……oh yes and may I say IT STILL BAFFLES ME AT HOW IGNORANT; AND EMPTY HEADED FOLKS LIKE JON can be when they know nothing other than what they see on TV and most of that today is very tainted to what the truth really is..JON AND OTHERS LIKE YOU…YOUR MIND IS BEING BRAINWASHED…..BEWARE! And Kim it is very nice of you to allow fools like this to speak…I guess they have freedoms too.
YOU….are an idiot. You obviously have no idea what it’s like to serve in a combat zone. You obviously have no idea what it’s like to be shot at. You obviously have no idea what it’s like to be shot at by the same @$$hole that you had in custody the week before, but had to let go due to ridiculous/liberal Army policy. By your incoherent babble I assume that you believe our goverment never locks up innocent people? They never make mistakes. What you’re telling me is that because of a rule or law…you wouldn’t stop the murdering or attempted murder of you or your family. Most likely…you wouldn’t and that’s what I call a coward. Look at yourself in the mirror, and take notice at what a cowardly, idiotic person you are. You’re probably small enough that none of this bothers you but just know that someone out there…cannot stand you. Just know that if you ceased to exist…someone out there would be happy about it. People like you should be rounded up and given to American soldiers as human shields. You’re not fit to call yourself an American…maybe an Iranian but definetely not an American.
I am in awe over this whole situation. I believe that it is wrong that these soldiers, men that sacrificed their time, their lives and everything that they have, to defend us Americans, are put into prison. This, I believe, is turning our backs on them. We don’t understand the whole situation that went on over there. They did what they felt was right, and they were protecting their fellow soldiers and the innocent people in Iraq. I am sure they did not kill these men, just to kill them. They did it because they knew that they were a threat. These are now four men that we do not have to worry about, because of these heros.
The one comment was about these Iraqi men having families and blah, blah, blah. Well these three heroes have families too, and now they are missing their children growing up, graduating and getting married. They are going to miss growing old with their loving wives. This, America took away from them. These men, I believe, did not kill, they were doing their jobs and protecting their fellow soldiers and we, as Americans.
I am appalled, and embarrassed at our court system. There is a part of me that is embarrassed to call myself an American.
We are very sorry that you are having to go this, in this case, alone again. We will never truly know or understand what really happend there at the canal. We will never understand why well trained soldiers, leaders at that, would make such rash decisions. Again, we will never understand.
My opinion, and for the record it is only my opinion, is that we are priviledged to have a court system, at times can be corrupt, but you are innocent until proven guilty. To do what these soldiers did was wrong. They are heroes once they step off US soil and will always be heroes…that is not the point now. Their status has changed, their lives will be forever changed. Those taped confessions speak for themselves…or at least what the government allowed for us to see…nonetheless, think of the wives and children that have no voice in that country. They only know war and to defend their men.
Be grateful that you still have your husbands (alive), like the men who were killed in the canal, their wives and families are grieving more than you could ever imagine.
Your husbands disobeyed orders and MURDERED four men.
This website is bad and you should feel bad for making it.
inb4erage
Mailinator;
YOU must be one of the many terrorist that WE HATE; AND I COULD SAY MORE …BUT YOUR NOT WORTH IT.
I would hope our government quietly pardons these four sergeants and gets them home to their families.
This Democrat believes that if those men never did anything else in their lives, their entire existence would be justified by what they did that day.
I will write my representative to express my hope that these men are released as soon as possible.
Please turn this site into a petition site to submit to legislators and politicians. “We the people” of this country do not agree with this judgement, and is a tragic injustice to our men in uniform. This would of never happened if bureauocrats didnt make it happen by turning our soldiers into police officers. This is unacceptable. These men had the courage to think of their comrades before themselves!
Those that feel this killing was somehow ‘justified’: where do you draw the line? If the wife of one of the dead men made them dinner, shouldn’t she be similarly executed for aiding the enemy? And surely those dead mens’ children will grow up to wield weapons against US soldiers…so perhaps we should execute them as well.
If the ROE is wrong…get it changed. Don’t take lives unjustly. Attempting to rationalize these executions is just as morally reprehensible as the act itself.
Anyone who calls these ‘men’ heroes should be ashamed. They are cowards who committed a cowardly act. They are where they should be.
CPT Bud Greenspan
2ACR
What worries me most is that police are reading these supportive comments. How many will now ‘take care of’ suspects who they know are guilty, but lack the evidence to convict.
Following the rule of law is very difficult. However:
“All that is needed for evil to succeed, is for decent human beings to do nothing.”
Edmund Burke
And I am glad that decent human beings did something – CONVICT !
They are heroes, and deserve our gratitude, understanding, and sympathy. However, they broke the law.
Everyone should read The Oxbow Incident in school.
I am with you all the way. I know they did the right thing. If I were in their boots I would have done the same thing. I want to thank the three Sgt for their service and I am proud of them. They should receive a pardon. They did the best they could. Their action saved other men lives. I can not understand why our men are being punished for doing their jobs. I support the three Sgt. totally. They should be given Medals and released so they can go back and finish what they started. They are all good Joes in my book. In the old army they would be given a carton of smokes, a 30 pass, a pat on the back and then sent back to their units. Today’s army is all screwed up. Most of the people who think other wise have never been in combat or been under fire. I say to those people. Never judge a man until you have walked a mile in that man’s boots. May the Lord Bless them and their families.
These men were soldiers under extreme pressure… but that does NOT mean it is OK to kill the prisoners!!!
Sure, the same insurgents could have been the ones to kill their buddies… I’m sure of it! But they were being released on…
NOT ENOUGH EVIDENCE…
Which means there was NOT ENOUGH EVIDENCE to hold/punish them. There is a reason for that… and the reason is that one of the four men could have been innocent… the Iraqi’s are under pressure too… their brothers and uncles are blowing themselves up, and they must do it or be disowned from the family or killed… a lot of these insurgents are forced into servitude…
It is unbelievable that anyone would support the decision of these soldiers to take the law into their own hands, and EXECUTE non-convicted persons.
Guess what Americans say… “innocent until proven guilty”
these men were not proven guilty… and so
Your Sergeant Heros killed FOUR INNOCENT MEN.
There are always extreme pressures (just think of the pressures these Iraqis are feeling when their friend and family are being blown up or blowing themselves up? What if your dad told you… son if you don’t blow yourself up today, you are a coward and you are the devil?)
but this does not mean that we are to take matter into our own hands…. because you’re BIASED to begin with, and you need evidence for a reason…
because I’d rather see a thousand guilty men go free than have ONE INNOCENT PERSON EXECUTED.
This battallion arrested 950 men and when they were being releaed, the troops re-filed paperword to hold them.
It is obvious to see the CLEAR MOTIVE then… they are arresting hundreds of people without evidence, and expecting them to be held. They feel that their work is not being given the recognition it deserves. They feel that they must protect their troops because SOME-not-ALL of these men might be coming back to get them. So they weighed the lifes of their troop as more important than hundreds of Iraqis. That is wrong. You cannot expect to REFORM a COUNTRY (isn’t that why we’re there in the first place?) with new values if you do not uphold them yourself. Here in America, we put Freedom in front of Security. That means, unfortunately, that you have to let a thousand guilty men go free.
The only way to make things right is to keep doing and teaching right. Unfortunately, killing the lives of four probably-guilty men to save your platoon just isn’t American.
I am truly sorry that these men who served their country in the most dangerous field of work forgot themselves briefly and committed murder. I feel for them and for their wives.
But that does not change the fact that it was the wrong thing to do. I’m sorry things had to turn out this way. I probably would have done the same thing as them – war will put that kind of pressure on you – but i would have gone to prison knowing that I made the wrong decision in a time of weakness.
Peace.
I am sorry that you lost your husband, but, as an enlisted veteran, I consider myself lucky that I did not have leadership like his. It is NOT an enlisted soldiers job to like or not like certain rules, regulations, or policies. It is an enlisted soldiers job to execute the mission. It is a leaders responsibility to step down from their leadership position if they are unable to execute that mission within the guidelines provided. A REAL leader does not ask his soldiers to choose between right and wrong. I am so glad I was not under his leadship because I would of been scared to death. What would he have done to me if I disagreed with him?? Would he have executed me too?? I think he would have. If he was under that much stress he should have turned in that diamond to his commanding officer.
This is war people. “May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won’t.” – General George Smith Patton Jr.
I THINK WE SHOULD KILLEM ALL AND TAKE OVER.
We are being laughed at…and killed at the same time, by the same mutts.
No need to say WAKE UP AMERICA… if we’ve been asleep thru all this, it’s probably time to throw in the towel, and admit defeat by idiots.
The idiots I speak of call themselves Americans…
Unfortunately, even heroes do bad things. I am a former Army Medic. War places an awful lot of stress on people. Sometimes that leads people to do things that are out of character and wrong. But when you do something that is wrong, you must be held accountable for your actions. While these soldiers are heroes and I commend them for their service, what they did was wrong and a violation of the law. It doesn’t matter if al-Queda or the Iraqi’s play by the same rules or not. We are legally bound to play by those rules. When we do stuff like this, it opens up a whole can of worms that leads to more abuses on our soldiers when they are captured as well as makes more enemies amongst the people we are supposed to be saving. I feel sorry for the families, but breaking the law is breaking the law. No one is above the law. Taking vigilante action is a violation of the UCMJ and the code of Conduct and that also effects the morale of others there. It just cannot be tolerated. These brave soldiers are in my thoughts and prayers and I hope that they have learned a lesson from this. I am glad to see that their sentences were reduced, but I hope they grow from this and rise above what happened.
Blessings,
Rev. Eric Roberts
Disabled vet
4/6 Inf Mechanized, Medical Platoon
Fort Polk, LA
1986-1989
It saddens me to see so many hardened against these heros…yes I said HEROS….As I have been told the ROE (rules of engagement) change many times…so that tells me that whatever the rules were …they were not good to begin with….In my opinion; we should give our military the firepower it needs to get the job done or get everybody out and protect our own country here in the USA. That is just my opinion and THANKS for letting me have the freedom to say so….I would caution those of you who are watching CNN….the media has a tendency to turn things around and make them seem what it is not. The men in question pursued the enemy PERIOD. How can you NOT call the so called terrorist (with lots of firepower) not enemies? When the USA propells firepower into so-called enemy territory…no doubt there will be “innocent” lives lost or is there? If the so-called “innocent” protect the terrorist- you become terrorist …you cannot be both terrorist or friend…one of the other… The decision was made to go to WAR when the terrorist came on our SOIL and tried to tear America apart. 1 Corinthians 16; 13 “Watch ye, stand fast in the faith, be brave, be strong.”
How do you win a war where you cannot harm the enemy but they can kill you?
Our troops fight against an enemy who hides behind deceit. They use women and children and religious houses as shields so that they are free to plot and shoot from behind a safety net while our troops stand with their hands tied behind their backs. They shoot at us, then drop their weapons to “surrender” and then pick up the weapons again when our backs are turned.
The public judge and the government dictates on the rules of warfare so that our enemies’ rights may be preserved. The United States will NOT win this war because we’re fighting with a different set of rules than our enemies! Let the troops do their job or pull them out! Don’t send them there to die.
Having worked with C Co. 1-26 IN during the Surge, I can understand your situation. Those were dark times, and in the middle of the chaos, your husband did what he had to do, guilty or innocent. What is the difference between murder and combat? Your husband should be released, via presidential pardon if necessary. He sounds like an outstanding NCO, and I hope I can become half the leader he is.
I am glad that you acknowledge yourself and every other man or woman who has served in combat a murderer… because what is the difference between combat or murder?
I hope it goes well with your family and friends when you refer to yourself as that.
Oh and your determination of what is right or wrong when it comes to taking a life… brilliant. You are definitely living up to your title.
Outstanding work, Murderer.
Ann wrote:
“Killing captured insurgents is not doing the right thing. Murder is murder,
regardless of what army you’re in. They are just lucky they didn’t get the death
penalty.”
Wow! It is scary to see how many idiots actually call America home. I think ALL of you who are defending these TERRORIST that would have killed John Hatley and his men had they been given the chance, should all pack you bags and move to Baghdad! I am glad we have people like John Hatley to defend us. If we had to depend on the likes of you idiots, we would all be dead!!
My first comment is: How can you convict someone for murder when there is no body, no forensic evidence?
Secondly, for someone who has never been in a war zone where the people on the other side play by different rules, this may seem harsh. But the Iraqis do not play by the same rules. They will have friends lie and cheat to convince the gullible americans that they are upright citizens.
We Americans stand for something higher, taking action into our own hand is not one of them. Justice is justice. They knew the consequences of their actions. I support our troops but I will not support rogue acts.
God bless
Amen to that, brother. If we as a nation don’t stand for the rule of law, then we have failed in our mission.
“All that is needed for evil to succeed, is for decent human beings to do nothing.”
Edmund Burke
And I am glad that decent human beings did something!
It is time for us to quit “tippy-toen” around and get business taken care of….
The enemy is laughing at you. They all are, They killed 3,000 in one act and still you debate. Have you forgotten?
Well… on the whole they killed 3000 and are laughing… Conservative estimates of Iraqi casualties are now at 80,000 to 100,000. American losses are at 4600 or so… + 9/11 and Afghanistan… For a total of about 9000. Over seven years.
For perspective, that’s a little more than what the US lost on Iwo Jima. In two weeks.
Admittedly, the Iraqis are doing a rather good job of killing each other, but it was the US that cracked the shell of the system and replaced it with nothing. I don’t think anyone is laughing too hard at anyone right now. It’s just not a very funny situation. It’s a rather sick, sad situation actually.
I feel horrible for the men and women and all sides caught up in this utter disaster. I also feel horrible that these three men just took a page from their old commander in chief’s playbook and decided to act unilaterally. But hey… heroes don’t shoot unarmed men in the back of the head.
You know how people judge a fight as over the line in sports? The whole “We’ll know it when we see it?” approach? Well… we just saw it.
Look – someone, somebody, is setting off and setting up bombs on a daily basis over there that are killing our soldiers – daily bombs and lots of them – so – if they found weapons in the same direction they were being fired at from and the guys had gunpowder on their hands than ummmmm I wonder if they were making bombs. SOMEONE OR SOMEBODY OVER THERE IS. WHY WOULD IT NOT HAVE BEEN THOSE 4 GUYS! If someone had been trying to shoot your brother day after day from the house across the street and you went over and found guns but you knew if you turned him in he would be set free to shoot at your brother again. Would you risk your brothers life or kill him?
These guys have seen and been through so much. Maybe they just didnt know what to do – but they were trying to do the right thing – I just know it.
My husband is a Medic.
Killing captured insurgents is not doing the right thing. Murder is murder, regardless of what army you’re in. They are just lucky they didn’t get the death penalty.
Ann – if Murder is Murder – then what about the Murder that was avoided by these soldiers acting. The very next day when these insurgents were planting bombs and shooting to KILL our men and MURDERING them – you wouldnt have been on a blog writing about it – you would have been out shopping with your friends while the wives, sons and daughters of these soldiers are crying and begging God to make it stop. PLEASE put yourself in these soldiers shoes before you blog around trying to make a statement that you know nothing about first hand. Go to a base meet soldiers and their families hear some stories and then come back and write. Or better yet – go to Iraq or Afghanistan and discover the life that our soldiers have to live. Fighting a war that has no end or face but are doing it because you wont and someone has to do it.
Proud wife of an U.S. Army Medic – thats fighting so that you can go shop!!!!
C.T.,
That was very WELL PUT!!! We will never understand what happened, but Our SOLDIERS are getting punished everytime I turn around for being SOLDIERS!! They are doing there jobs!! In my eyes they are HEROS!!! And these NCO’s should not be punished! The Army has better things to do like, FIGURE OUT HOW MAJ. HASAN SLIPPED THROUGH THE CRACKS! WHEN ARE THE TERRORISTS GONNA PAY FOR WHAT THEY HAVE DONE TO OUR SOLDIERS AND FAMILIES AND ALL THE CIVILIANS THAT LOST THEIR LIVES IN 9/11 UNTIL PRESENT? AND AS FOR ANN AND TO ANYONE ELSE THAT IS QUICK TO JUDGE, YOU JOIN THE ARMY OR ANY OTHER BRANCH AND WALK A FEW YEARS IN THEIR BOOTS AND IN THE SPOUSES AND IN OUR CHILDRENS BOOTS. MY HUSBAND AND CT’S HUSBAND DO WHA THEY DO SO THAT YOU CAN HAVE THE FREEDOM OF SPEECH THAT WE ALL HAVE AND YOU CAN GO SHOPPING AND BLOGGING AS YOU PLEASE, WHILE WE WERE LOCKED DOWN AND MY CHILDREN SCRARED TO DEATH STUCK AT SCHOOL BECAUSE OF PEOPLE LIKE HASAN AND THE TERRORISTS!!!!
PROUD ARMY WIFE AND A PROUD USA VETERAN!!!!
No bodies , no case. However if they admit
To doing it, they got off light. As
A soldier or marine , you follow orders
Whether you agree with them or not.
But just like the sex offender who
Moves down the street , you can’t just
Go get him and take him to the woods
And shoot him in the back like a coward,
Just because you feel they will do
It again. Noone asked you to put on
That uniform. You volunteered. There
Hasn’t been a draft in over 40 years.
I was in somalia and bosnia 93, 94.
And no matter how bad things got,
Noone took it upon themselves to
Cowardly shoot insurgents in the back!
If all 3 of you are innocent, I
Wish you a speedy return. If you
Actually did what you are accused
Of, you’re a coward and deserve what
You get. What makes you hero’s?
Stay strong 1st SGT. It is a shame when politics become involved in war, sounds ironic but it’s true. Even with experience of being deployed myself , I cannot imagine the situations, circumstances and stress you and your unit endured. Desperate times call for desperate measures…. My thoughts and prayers are with you.
John,
do not know if you remeber me, my borther Sgt. Michael Edwards served with you in Iraqi and both of you were stationed in Germany. You were also his best man at his wedding in September 2005. Though I only saw you this one day and our interaction was limited, you left a lasting impression on me. Mike speaks very highly of you and you know he is hard to please! He says “there is no one else i would rather be in a hole with”. The Army has lost a natural leader and a figure for our men and women to aspire to be like.
I have followed your case and have been brought to tears on several occasions. I am truly sorry for what has happened to you and the other gentlemen. I have heard the “full” story from mike and I applaude you for standing up and saving your life as well as the lives of the other Army/Marine personel. If those 4 men were released again and did kill/injury someone that would have weighted on you and your company. My thoughts and prayers are with you and your family at this time. I truly believe that the 19 1/2 yrs you dutifully served our country will not be in vain and you will be pardoned!
Best Wishes,
Christina Edwards Cong and Family
Also, with respect to the headline on this page referring to the “alleged” killing…
You no longer get to confuse viewers here with this. He’s has been convicted of pre-meditated murder.
Also, “no forensic evidence proving they were killed”?
Does Hatley contend no one has even died?
What is the goal behind the wordplay on this site?
So you arrested 837 top tier targets? What does that tell you…that everyone is part of the resistance…
There are command and control rules of engagement. It is not up to the individual soldiers to go above or outside of them and arbitrarily execute people off the battlefield. If that was allowed, the chaos that would ensue would limit any sort of rule of law or command structure.
You know it amazes me in the direction our country is headed. I have never been to war, so for me to sit here and try to judge these “Great Men” would be unjust. I just thank all of our brave men and women overseas and pray to God the United States gets its own head out of it ass soon. We are at WAR!!! I don’t see Al-Qaeda or Taliban playing by the same rules so how the hell are we suppose to win this Holy War? Be glad I can never be President….I would pull all of our soldiers out and Nuke the fu***** Middle East. See Washington problem solved!!!! That damn easy!
These Americans ARE Fighting For America, WHY are criminals in this country given the free pass, and soldiers whose job by the way is protecting our country have to ride some imaginary political roller coaster Death Happens in war , This is a disgrace to taxpaying citizens stop wasting money on court cost etc etc on someone who is doing there Job God Bless The Soldiers and God Bless The USA ,Lord knows we need it
Just so I’m clear, did John execute 4 blindfolded, hand cuffed men? Very tough circumstances, thank political leadership for creating an environment where this seemed to be the only resolution. Also, it seems shady that these men couldn’t be identified or even found. Does that really make Hatley look less guilty? Let me say that I don’t wish the jobs of our soldiers on anyone, and am amazed by our men in uniform who are able to maintain composure in that environment. They truly are our best and brightest…I’m just not sure we saw that here.
THEY KILLED THEM DUE TO LACK OF EVIDENCE AND THEY FEARED THEIR RELEASE? PUT THAT INTO CIVILIAN LIFE HERE IF PEOPLE WERE EXECUTED THIS WAY. IT’S MIND BOGGLING THAT ANYONE, EVEN THE SOLDIER’S WIFE CAN THINK OF THEM HAS HEROES???
In reference to the ms response, GET A CLUE! These soldiers were not engaged in “civilian life.” They were engaged in a WAR!!! War is ugly and we ask our young men and women to deploy for many, many months at a time to defend their country…they should also be defending themselves and each other. I don’t believe, given the same circumstances, that anyone would afford an enemy with multiple opportunities to kill our young men and women. Some of these comments are obviously made by people that have never sacrificed for their country. It’s difficult for the military to fight a war when the country isn’t. I vote the draft be reinstated – then we can see how civilians really react when it’s their lives on the line. These soldiers should be freed! Written by the proud mother of a soldier.
You would think differently if it was you. Maybe you should go overseas so you can see the danger for yourself before you open your mouth. They are heroes and should not be in prison. And another thing why are you even on this website if you don’t support this family? You really should be ashamed of yourself!!!
HEROS!!! ok if thats what you want to call your husband and the other 2 involved. Those men knew what they were doing and still did it anyway!! I beleive they should be put in jail for LIFE!! Oh wait they are!! This nation is held to a high level we dont stoop down to there level, just b/c they dont have no code of conduct level or dont follow the geneva codes it doesnt give us the right to break them. As far as I know your husband and the other 2 are scums of the earth and deserve to rot in hell!!! They are a disgrace to this country!! what happened to there HONOR, COURAGE, COMMITMENT!!
hey chief let me ask you something, have you EVER put on a military uniform? and actually saw and been involved in any kind of combat? Have you ever lost 6 men you considered to be your brothers? WILL YOU PLEASE GO TO YOUR NEAREST RECRUITER AND ASK THEM TO PLEASE TRY TO TURN YOU INTO A MAN AND SEND YOUR ASS TO COMBAT AS AN INFANTRYMAN.
Right on Chris. Couldn’t have said that better myself
you will never be a man until you fight in a war that you are too simple minded and blindly patriotic to understand. just go fight, that will make you a man. the reasons do not matter. american lives are worth everything and iraqis are a dime a dozen. if you ask me, what makes a man is the ability to be rational, to think and to empathize. not just the ability to go on a rampage and kill innocent people. that makes you an animal.
These people are not our friends they do not play by the The rules of engagement, silly to think they were captured just for being in the wrong place at the wrong time let’s not be so naive. While I do not condone murder, we cannot ignore the many other circumstances and conditions your husband was fighting under. My brother served in vietnam and he was never the same man that left, I wish you and your family the best.
i am so sorry you have lost your husband but he is war criminal and not a hero. hero’s don’t execute POW’s.
He would be a hero to you, if it was your brother, daddy, Uncle, sister, friend or yourself that he was protecting from being killed. You would just say thank you.
To all you people that say these soldiers are terrorist. Why don’t you go to Iraq or Afghanistan pick up a rifle and defend your country. I was in The United States Marine Corp. I was an 0311 Infantryman and If I were in there shoes I would have done the same thing I have seen it first hand that where we make grounds in the battle only to release these iraqis and afghans hours after they set up ieds or hours after they shoot @ our troops. So if you haven’t been over seas fighting for your country then you need to not say anything about these soldiers. Were over ther fighting for your freedom and sometimes we have to do things that aren’t in the Geneva conventions! My heart goes out to any family that has lost someone or that is going through what these families are. We give you the right to say what you want but we have the right to punch you in the mouth if don’t agree!!! SEMPER FI!!!
It is a shame that so many people choose to judge these brave solders instead of supporting them. Perhaps those who criticize these solders for protecting our country should join the army and volunteer to go to Iraqi. I’m sure this would change there view. It is a very dangerous place. Even if you don’t support the war. If you are ordered to go to Iraqi, you must go. You have no choice. I do not know of any other country who would treat their soldiers with such injustice. As a country, who do we think we are fooling? America is viewed by much of the world as stupid. Because of policies like this. For those of you who criticize. Do us all a favor. Join the army. If you live to tell about it, you can come back and do some more complaining.
They cannot be pardoned. It was not their duty to act as judge, jury, and executioner for these men. Even if they’re enemies, killing an unarmed, detained POW is a crime. Imagine the outrage you would feel if your husband was executed as a prisoner who was about to be released, simply because his captors felt justified in doing so. Now think of the families these executed men might have had and the suffering they must be undergoing.
War is a form of murder, but justified by the social contract of war. Killing unarmed prisoners is, however, murder.
It is murder, but how would you feel if someone might being coming after you? To live in paranoia because some that tried to kill you was still on the loose? You shouldn’t criticize them for trying to protect their fellow soldiers when you haven’t even been there yourself.
okay, what if some thugs broke into your house and killed your family, then as you tried to defend yourself against them, they tied you up and killed you. would they be considered heroes? no, they are murderers, just like the american soldiers are.
Jase – You have it backward.
If someone broke into your house and killed your family. Later the police arrested them, and let them go. The next time they broke into your house you killed them. Are you a hero or a murderer? Most would say you are a hero.
These men are HERO’S and should be treated as such. Anyone making cowardly remarks should be where these men have been and walk in thier shoes. These men are put in harms way and this is how we thank them. Shame on you, and remember men like these give you the right to belittle them.
Your husband may have stopped four people from further engaging our brave soldiers on the field of battle. However, how many more Iraqis joined the fight after hearing about these criminal execution style killings? By stopping four, you may have created 40 new fighters. I understand your reasoning, and your husband has my sympathy, however, our military establishes rules of engagement for a reason.
I understand that your family is hurting, but what these soldiers did was wrong, plain & simple.
Jim Davidson, really? Do you really know if they had wives or children? No I don’t know that but do you know that for sure? How do you know if they weren’t single?
James wrote:
“Real heroes do the right thing even though it may be difficult. The right thing
here was not to kill unarmed men because you didn’t believe there was enough evidence to hold them.”
UNARMED men??? Are you serious??? Did you see and hear about the cache of weapons that was found??? We all know if they had not done what they did, they would have been killed or more innocent Americans and Iraqi’s would have been killed! These were NOT innocent men, just out for a picnic–they were up to no good! My husband worked with 1SG Hatley many years ago. We are close personal friends of John and Kim’s. John Hatley is NOT a cold blooded killer and would never have killed these men if he did not feel it was them or his guys! John Hatley is a hero and a top notch, hard working,dedicated soldier!! My husband has been to Iraq and Afghanistan 3 times in 5 yrs. Each time for more than a year! These men come home haunted by what they have experienced. They do not want to do some of things they have to do, but they do it because that is there job! The pay sucks and the hours and responsibilities suck even worse! Walk a mile in their combat boots-then decide! People who have never been in a war and never sent a loved one off to war not knowing if you will ever hold them again, then chose to judge their actions need to volunteer and go over there for a while and see what it is like to live that nightmare!
These soldiers made a huge error in judgment. They acted outside their orders and violated their soldier creeds and oaths. However, they are not criminals but men who made a bad choice in difficult time.
In the insanity of war and finding themselves in a strange land among strange people, they found their own heart of darkness. These men need correction.
A dishonorable discharge with a few years in prison would be enough.
is that what you think should happen to an iraqi combatant who kills 4 unarmed americans?
John,
I am an Asian Indian, I feel so sorry for what had happened to you though i will be not be able to understand your pain. I hope that God will protect you and keep you safe. Dont give up but keep praying. Remember the truth will set you free…that what Lord Jesus told us. May God bless you.
Dave.
Oh give me a break! american soldiers have no right to be in iraq in the first place, it’s a war of conquest and imperialism and if you believe otherwise you are severely confused. iraqis are being killed in their homes and should defend themselves in any means necessary. How can you compare the military of the most powerful country in the world to the military powers of a poor ass country like iraq? if i was iraqi, and i guarantee if any of you gun lovers were iraqi, you would be fighting the americans with every ounce of strength you had. let these murderers rot in jail where they belong. since when is an iraqi’s life worth less than an american’s?
When are americans going to get there heads out of there butt’s and realize that when you are at war you must kill your the ememy anywhere and in any building or church they fire at you from.
Quit being so stupid and quit feeling sorry for the dumb bastard shooting at our military, your correct they should not have taken them to a canal, they should have killed them in place without mercy the same way they would us.
if we have to blow a church up or a house to eliminate the enemy do it, if we dont this war will go on for ever.
stop the politics and support our troops!!!!!!!!!!!
the point is that these men were unarmed, they were no threat to the american soldiers. who knows if they were combatants or terrorists or whatever you want to call them, because they are dead now and we will never know their story. maybe they WERE trying to kill americans but maybe they were among the hundreds of thousands of other innocent iraqis who were killed. unfortunately we will only know the american side of this story because history is written by the conquerers. these guys are war criminals and they got exactly what they deserved.
They were unarmed when they were killed by the canal true, but according to the report they had a weapons cache and fired on the troops prior.
so they should have just killed them in place when the troops first to fire from them and avoided all of this.
if they had a weapons cache and fired at them previously that would be grounds to hold them would it not?
Ryan,
I agree with you that this is a war of conquest and imperialism. I agree that our soldiers should not be over there…. however, it is not the soldiers’ fault that they are there. Our American government ordered them to go to war. Don’t blame the soldiers for the war.. blame George Bush.
-Jeanna
it’s their fault for signing up. nobody forced them to, and if you ask me, if you live in america and truly believe that they are fighting for world peace.. well then you are obviously only suited to getting shot in the desert.
i know its heart breaking that your husband is going to jail, but in light with the trust the military put on him, he violated every code he took an oath to protect.
I do understand that the place is violent (i am an 11B myself), but the one thing that differentiate us from them is our actions. When you take four people, tie hands behind their backs and put shots behind their heads, to me you are as cold as a local thug. War has rules; read rules of engagement.
If we use your husband actions and every infantryman in the field mirrors his actions, there would no difference between the militia and us. And i hope that him going to jail will be lesson to many.
I have followed this story closely. With sympathize deeply with your situation and you are in my family’s thoughts and prayers
Don’t give up!
Real heroes do the right thing even though it may be difficult. The right thing here was not to kill unarmed men because you didn’t believe there was enough evidence to hold them.
War is filled with tremendous tradegy on both sides. I lived in a foreign country until I was 9 yrs old and remember civillian neighborhoods being bombed from the air by military aircraft all in the name of killing “the enemy”. The people killed were often innocent civillians just going shopping for groceries or walking to school. The only way to stop this madness and sufferring for the civillians and the US troops who are being asked to do police work instead of fighting a war is to stop this war, bring our troops home, compensate all those who sufferred, grant clemency to the troops who may have made mistakes in judgement, and demand our government change our policies so we don’t find ourselves in this kind of mess in the future. You and your family have my deepest sympathy.
Terrorists should be terminated; heroes should be eulogized; I would do the same thing – having no mercy on those Islamic fascists. Be strong…
If a woman is raped and decides to take revenge on her rapist by killing him…she will stand trial as a murderer.
If a man’s home is broken into several times by the same person and finally the man decides to shoot the man…he will stand trial for murder.
If a woman is repeatedly abused by her husband and decides to kill him…she will stand trial for murder.
Why are these three American soldiers any different?
The Iraqi men these American soldiers murdered are human beings. Human beings, like you and me.
Just because one is a soldier does not mean one should receive preferential treatment.
These three soldiers are terrorists as well, whether you like to think so or not. They are not heroes.
It’s people like you that make other countries hate us and why their is senseless violence in this world.
According to 43% of the rest of the world, we are terrorists and therefore should endure being terminated as to your beliefs.
A hero you are not nor ever shall be. An ignorant subhuman you are forever categorized. Be strong…
I find it very ironic that the spouses are calling their husbands “HEROES” when they are admitting themselves to cold blooded killing of civilians. Soldiers are heroes when they do a service for their country and protect it, NOT GO TO ANOTHER COUNTRY AND KILL INNOCENT CIVILIANS.
For the remaining war mongerers, where is “What would Jesus Do” in the issue? Being a “True American” means speaking out for justice, not against it.
I am sure you are going through a tough time but so did the families of the Iraqis killed by your husband and the other two.
I served 2 tours in Iraq and 1 in Afghanistan and endured what many others never shall. Yet, I never took my agression or anger out on people who I assumed would cause me harm. It definitely takes a strong mind and will to do the right thing and your husband and the others didn’t have it.
It’s sad that six people ended up ruining their lives for what they believed in.
My sypmathies go to you and the other families but not to your husband or the other two.
“I know it’s more severe than that, but I mean if somebody kept coming in and breaking into your house, I think that the person would either want to get a gun or something to protect themselves because you feel like in your own home, you can’t even be safe.”
mmm….interesting comparison….except that your husband was the one who went to another country and broke into people’s home and terrorized them and then assasinated them….so please try again and find a better argument….a good way to start would be to apologize and ask clemency to those Iraqi famillies who lost their loved ones.
I agree completely. Her husband was in Iraq, not his house. Their behavior was disgraceful and now there are more women and children in this world (So what if they are Iraqi, they are God’s children, also) who have lost their husbands/fathers. Pathetic that not only would anyone try to excuse this cowardly act, but to actually call it heroic? Disgusting.
HMMM. “We are terrorizing them” interesting and DISGUSTING comment, DAVID. WAR is not something that one wants to do…but is commanded to act in order to PROTECT the freedoms of one’s self and well-being, as well as the country’s well being. AND the great people who serve in our armed forces swore an oath to stand behind the USA in keeping our FREEDOMS. Have you forgotten about the terrorists that came here? IN our home? Some of you out there will truly never know what true freedom and liberty consist of, because you do not know the true history of our country. PLEASE GET EDUCATED…Also may I add that some of you are forgetting that NO bodies were found – NO evidence was found- as far as I know just an interrogation tape of (in my opinion) abused heros—mentally–abused by the very ones they were under oath to protect…..I for one (and can speak for many others) am proud that we have men like MSG John Hatley; Mayo and Leahy…they are the REAL MEN of this world and my heart and prayers are with them and their families. And in the end….God will see justice through!
The same God that says “Thou shalt not kill”
It’s hard for me to comprehend how there are people out there that truly believe God is on your side for everything. He is not only your God. Just because you believe that what you do is right, doesn’t mean that God backs you just because you believe in him.
All those who tells others what God likes and dislikes are a bunch of hypocrites who hide behind religion.
Your acts are just as those Iraqi men and women. They fight for what they believe in, just as do you.
You are the same.
Are all of you blind. We are in a ***** war. That is the very reason why we will not should get the hell out of there. USA isn’t ready for war.
Since when did your husband become judge and jury? In a society of laws and consequences your husband was rightly sent to jail for cold blooded murder.
Don’t forget these men went to war for us, regardless of whether you agree or don’t agree with this war.
You commit an act of cold blooded murder, you pay the price. The Iraqi’s were killed in their homeland. They had wives and children too you know.
Stay strong. You are a hero. None of us know the day to day struggles you soldiers endure. We cannot judge you.I for one, as a proud American, consider you a hero. You guys stopped 4 men from killing any more Americans or innocent Iragis. I will write my congressmen on your behalf. Thank-you for all you have done to keep us free and safe from terrorists, now it is our turn to take care of you. May God bless you!!
Does you not understand that these 4 Iraqi men which our U.S. soldiers killed had been taken CAPTIVE by our soldiers?
They are human beings as well.
“Thank-you for all you have done to keep us free and safe from terrorists…”
The three men who conspired and plotted to kill these 4 Iraqi men are terrorists as well.
Until we as human beings decide to rise above violence and terror as a means of solving problems, these problems will continue.
Oh, and by the way, in considering these American soldiers ‘heroes,’ you are, indeed, making a judgement.
MSG Hatley, my heart goes out to you. I was your driver in your first OIF deployment OIFII 04-05. I can not explain the amount of my frustration at all of this. We survived a near ambush together and had it not been for you getting my head and others in the game only hours earlier, I shiver to think of what could have happened. Stand strong brother. My heart is filled with nothing but honor for you. I Pray that this will be resolved honorably.
I was in Iraq around the time this “incident” happened, I know how truly messed up things were at that time.
TOP I can only hope that this madness you’re going through ends at one point. The goddamn army needs NCO’s with a set of balls! People back here have no idea what it’s like doing op’s in Baghdad, I conducted over 200 missions and lost two men. If the charges were dropped against the marines at Haditha then what the hell is going on here!
May God bless you and give you the strength to face this. I hope things work out positively for you and John. A Salute to John for his bravery and the many years he put in to serve this country. One of the many reasons why my family is safe here and has the opportunity to live life and enjoy it. Thank you.
Stay Strong John, Best wishes Jeff Clark
Kim,
Is there anyone that I can write to help with the appeal process or to get the word out? I am heartsick over this treatment of our fighting men. Please advise me if there is anyway that I can help.
Sherri LeNoir
Groesbeck, Texas
As a army infantry vet, Afghanistan vet, and Iraq vet, and ranger, I’m appalled by this. no one knows how it is over there.
one minute the cameras are on and the kids are waving, and smiling, saying how much they love America, and as soon as the camera is off, and you back is turned, they are on the cell phone setting off the IED. 8,9,10 year old kids killing, just because some cleric told them to.
I just want to say I hope you get through this msg. sgt. and i with you. ooorah… rangers lead the way…
God bless you and your family. Our military is our means of survival. How do we keep a standing army of active duty volunteers when they’re at risk for 3rd, 4th, and 5th deployments plus criminal prosecution? Again, God bless and God speed.
I am so sorry for this, I served in 1-26 from 03-05, 1-18 was are Sister BN. 1SG did not deserve this. When is are judicial system ever gonna get it right. HE SHOULD BE A FREE MAN!!
I served under 1SG Hatley during OIF 06-08 and it was the greatest honor of my life. John showed me what it was to truly be a soldier and he is the standard I constantly try to maintain, and he is still the best noncomissioned officer I have ever seen. He was a father to us all.
Hey Aunt Kim, I just wanted to let you know i love you and Uncle John so much and i think yall are the two most bravest people i have met! Yall both are very strong people. You have done such a great job at putting everything together=) I know that Uncle John will win this overall because we have God on our side and nobody can take him down=) Yall both just hang in there and I love yall more than you can imagine!!
Kelsey Miles=)…
I loved having the honor to serve with 1st sgt hatley. He is a man of honor and kept us as safe as he honestly could. I would love to help as much as i can Kim. Thanks Dustin.
What a great friend you are. You’re like a sister to me Kim,
I don’t know if I could have found a better friend! Love ya bunches. Prayers go out to you and John!
Dear Kim, My heart goes out to you and your husband. The blatant disregard of justice here has me sickend of our government and judical system. I will pray for your family as well as the other familys involved in this tragedy. Also I feel it only appropriate to send a donation to your husbands defense fund , ater how sweet you were to me at your yard sale…. Sincerely…..Misty(1 dollar for all the nice clothes) Phillips…..God Bless
John and Kim,
I think of you both daily. I pray for the both of you. I miss you John. I will see you soon. Stay Strong like you always were. Thanks for ALWAYS being there for me.
Kim, you and John are two of the most genuine, kind, strong people I have ever met. You helped me some much though that awful deployment and I can never thank you enough for that. And John brought me my husband home, safe alive and well. My husband has told me over and over if it were not for 1SG none of us would have made it back. I love you two so much!!!
Love always,
Mrs. Angela Lemon Slice Lesina
We think of you and the family often, remembering you in our prayers. We can never imagine what you have and are going through, but know God is always in control and faithful to see us through what ever the struggle. Stay strong in your faith in Christ and never give up. We love you and all of your family and you each hold a special place in our hearts.
I know kim and john for almost 5 years now and it brings tears to my eyes the whole story is just so sad,stay strong kim its all in gods hands!l
Keeping you in my Prayers. Surely Justice will win out for you. Thanking you for all you have done for our country.
Kim,
I am amazed by your strength. You are the strongest person I know and I feel privileged to know you and John.
I know John is so proud of you and everything you have accomplished and continue to accomplish everyday. You are a true hero in every sense of the word.
Served gladly as a Naval field RTO for more than 6 years. The lunacy of decisions such as these are what made myself and many others choose the safer path of not re-upping. Sadly, that also depletes our younger service people of those with the wisdom and experience to teach the necessities to both CM and stay alive whilst doing so. The checks and balances of out system have left too many “cake eaters” making wrongful solutions towards righful people. War is not an “event” that can readily be policed by those who’ve not been there. Politicians and career remf desk jockeys should not be in position to pass judgement on those who allow and provide our very freedom. It’s time for the well meaning citizenry of this nation and its military to realize that war is not a “game” to be scored on the principles developed in peace and decided by the unknowing. Set aside this erroneous verdict and allow our servicefolk to know that their backs are covered at home, instead of facing 2 fronts. When do we say, “enough, common sense is not a felony”? Today would be a good day to start, and what better place?! Carry on, and feel free to contact me for anything I can do. Bravo Zulu to you for your service and to the outstanding woman checking 6 for you.
I agree with you wholeheartedly…although I cannot speak for you, because I have never been where you are at….
but I will say in regards to “re-upping”….It would be nice to know that we have people like you, making the choice of re-upping…because YOU are exactly who we (America)need in places of importance….and it is probably the hardest job in the world….But God has your back.
Many thanks for the kind words…. Twas one of the hardest decisions made in my life to date, in regards to leaving service. Many factors weighed in, and to this day I’m not sure the right choice was made. Our military isone of the last remaining function of our society that functions mostly as it should. The troops need all of the support, experience and considerations that they can receive, from us each, one and all. May God watch over us all and rectify this travesty, both quickly and in a way that we can recognize. Briefings are given, sometimes daily, in the “legality” of actions that could transpire in a military evolution. Tis no place for lawyers and the faint hearted. Salute to the lady keeping this good fight front and center and may a positive and speedy resolution come for them all. Highest regards, Jeff Smith
To All Americans
Subject: MSG John Hatley a part of the Leavenworth Ten
Words do not express the appreciation I have towards our armed forces and all that they suffer in order to protect my freedom and security here in the United States of America.
My heart goes out not only to MSG John Hatley and his family but also to other patriots put in prison for so called violations of “rules of engagement”. The soldiers and families affected are going through trying times and facing many burdens in the future. They were put in prison for a crime they DID NOT COMMIT.
When does defeating an enemy during the time of war become a crime? In the heat of the battle, are we requiring our soldiers to say specific terms, make certain statements, and conduct certain acts, before they actually apprehend, and if given the chance, kill our enemy? If our so-called “rules of engagement” are ever-so changing, how do we ever expect to win a war?
MSG John Hatley has shed blood, sweat and tears for this country, never wavering once with regret or remorse for his brave and heroic acts. Such acts that have earned him a high rank of Master Sergeant with the Army Rangers… including taking a genuine personal interest in each of his soldiers and their families. His horrifically patriotic acts include pulling bloodied comrades out of a “fire fight”, while the blown up body parts of his other “boy” cover him beyond recognition. His encouragement and counseling to his “boys” during the heat of the battle is a strength that not many soldiers have and all the while fighting along beside them, instead of monitoring from afar. MSG Hatley did this for OUR FREEDOM…. for the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA..
Instead of jail time, MSG Hatley should be awarded a Medal of Honor for all that he has done for the United States of America. And yet, this being a high honor, it still does not seem enough for what he has gone through and is going through at this moment.
It is hard for me, and others, to believe that MSG Hatley will have to serve a 40 year sentence for a crime he pleaded not guilty to, and in effect, was at a time when he put his life in the shadow of death, for me, my country and my freedom. I have to stop and ask myself, “What is happening here?” Where is the real justice that our forefathers have fought to achieve? Are we altering lives into a curse of living hell because of political correctness? What about our men and women who were brave enough to put all on the line for ME?
I have family in the service; my children have mentioned that they may want to serve this country in a great way by going into the service. Will I be sending them into double turmoil…in which, not only will they have to watch their back from the enemy, but from their mother country as well! What a shame to be in such a predicament.
I feel if this “said” crime was investigated in more detail, the truth would become known, proving MSG Hatley’s innocence and that he is a True Patriot! He was fighting for all of our freedoms, and in the process being the ultimate patriotic example.
I am pleading with all Americans, to personally take an interest in John’s case and the other 9 patriots…called the Leavenworth Ten . A pardon needs to happen for these brave soldiers. Facts remain that prove their innocence, and that they were doing nothing more than THEIR JOB….they just happened to get tangled up in the web of “political correctness” and it has tainted their lives forever.
I have known the Hatley family since I was a small child and John’s father was my pastor, at a local Baptist Church in Kosse Texas. John was always an excellent role model for others and this proves itself through the fact of his service to his “boys” and country. After a service of 19 years, his record should hold account as to the type of person MSG John Hatley is and the soldier he has become.
May God have mercy on our souls for tossing aside those who were so brave and heroic, not for themselves, but for the United States of America!
“Blessed is the man that walks not in the counsel of the ungodly…” Psalm 1:1.
Just Sign me as: A Proud Patriot – Kenda Eckols
MSG John Hatley was stripped of his rank of Master Sergeant; given the rank of Private; and given a dishonorable discharge, serving 40 years for crime he did not commit.
Keep up the fire Kim!! your doing a hell of job i feel honored to have such a wonderful friend, who is always there when needed….thanks for the years of goodies and good advice…..will be dropping John a line soon. our connexes came in (my letter writing stuff is in there)…Keeping John you and Nick in my prayers..
Mongo
I am currently finishing up a tour in Iraq. I did not have the honor of serving with 1SG in 06-08, but sgt Leahy was a good friend of mine. The absurdity of of their trials and convictions is unreal. How we can be punished for what we are sent to do for our country, saving American lives, ill never understand. i wish the best to and your family kim, my prayers are with you. If anyone knows how to get in contact with sgt Leahy via letter or any other means i would appreciate it.
spc Fraser
i only served with 1SG for a few months and i have to say he is one of my greatest idols as a leader and i hope for the best for him and cant wait to hear more about his Clemency
I rode as a dismount with 1SGT Hatley for a week and conducted many joint operations with him over my time in the surge. My platoon was joined with his company at the JSS during OIF 6-8 I was a PV2 at the time but, I felt like he took me under his wing, as I’m sure he did for all the new soldiers. He was and is a huge role model for me and I hope one day to be the kind of NCO and man he is. My heart and prayers are with you and your family Kim.
SGT Love,
1-28INF
Would you have felt the same way if he gave you the order to pull the trigger on un-armed, detained unlawful combatants?
Those insurgents were shooting at our soldiers, so how is it that they were ‘unlawfully detained’?
John,
My thoughts and prayers are with you and your family. My brother was in Viet Nam and I do understand the need for our guys to be where they are right now. I would be totally remiss if I did not say to you thank you, because my brother would not be proud of me if I didn’t. So here is a really big Thanks!
I don’t know what I can do to help, but I will surely find out and do whatever I can. This is sent with love from me and all my family for your contribution to our freedom. God be with you and your family.
Kim,
My thoughts and prayers are with you and your family. Being a former marine I understand how the millitary works and for them to charge him with a crime, for which he was only doing his job is completely ridiculous. They tell these soldiers to go over there and do a job, but then punish them for doing their job. War is not a fun thing to go through. Over there you our fighting for americas freedom and our rights. that were given to us by our forefathers. These young men and women go there not knowing what to expect. They see things that any normal 20 year should not see. And at the same time they fighting and killing the enemy, to protect the red white and blue. It sickens me, being a former marine seeing how the millitary is treating our servicemembers when they are over there and when they get back to the states. Basically they are getting punished for doing their jobs. This is not right and all of us former and current servicemembers need to finally stand up to the government and put a stop to all of this.
Take care and hang in there.
OOH-RAH….
Cpl Todd Ray
Former Marine.
His job is not to kill un-armed, detained unlawful combatants. They should have taken them to the detention facility and deal with them on the battlefield.
His job is not to be a policeman, yet we ask our troops to wear many hats that dont fit, and they work hard to comply. Its easy to pass judgment from the safety and comfort of your home, but imagine yourself in his situation.
Knowing that you’re risking your life every day in an ultimately futile effort in what is basically a sick “catch and release” program would drive me mad. Mad enough to “murder”? Maybe.
The enemy deals with our troops by blowing them up with remote triggered IEDs, executing entire families, and picking of our soldiers in an asymmetrical guerrilla style engagement. These insurgents are not MS13 bangers in LA, and we cannot view them as such.
This story is horrible and sad and a true sign of the times. I am not even going to get into the whole agrument of “war is war” But i am so sick and tired of our country protecting the very people(iraqi’s, afganistans) that do harm to our countrymen. It makes no since to flight a war spilling our men and womens blood just to have it thrown back in their face….how is murder honestly commited during a war? freakin rediculous!
You’re a moron. These soldiers shot and killed 4 innocent people, and that’s all there is to it.
p.s.: its Afghans. Not “Afghanistans”
you are the moron!! you have no clue what these men and their families have had to face. You don’t know if they were innocent or not. You can not know what you would have done in their situation. Most of these men have served multiple times in Iraq and Afganistan and don’t even get the treatment they need before they are sent back. Most of them have some form of PTSD( Post Tramatic Stress Disorder) but reguardless the are thrown right back into fighting situations. People like you make me sad! I pray for your unforgiving and unloving souls!!!
I guess I will respond to Jack, but this is for Amy and most of the other people on this site since the site software will not allow responses past the 3rd tier… We know they are not innocent, because they have been found guilty. They broke the rules of the military and they must pay the price. You blame Jack for his unloving soul, but your statement makes no comment about the people they killed.
Simply because the people these soldiers killed while in our captivity fought our soldiers, their lives suddenly have no value and as the number of misplaced Bible quotes on this page show, are believed to be godless devils. You are the one’s that are valueless, you who allow conflict to get rid of our ethical existence in the name of valueless false patriotism.
Amy, for one second, step away from you emotions and look at it without bias. The fact of the matter is that these three NCO’s left good sense and judgment by the wayside and conspired to take justice into their own hands and kill un-armed, detained unlawful combatants. This violated LOAC and ROE. No matter how stellar their records were, no matter how they were good husbands and fathers, one incredibly HUGE lapse in judgement condemned them and their families for a very long time.
I am not talking with my emotions half of the people on are ready to Judge and sentence people without knowing all of the things that lead up to these men being killed. I don’t know what exactly happend I do know that our military is very willing to sacrafice our men to save themselves. If they were not they would treat out soldiers for their PTSD and stop throwing them back in harms way. Do i agree with the killings No if they were not in self defense. Am I going to judge these men who did NO I am not God and do not know the whole story only the men it involves know the story. Their are many on here that need to read the bible because there are stories of when God sent his people into battle he told them not to save anyone or any animal to kill them all. War is not a pleasant thing and you cannot expect that everyone will be ok that is sent inot battle and have to fight for their lives and kill someone will be ok with it just because it is self defense. WE do not know the state of mind our soldiers are in it is not like everyday life over there. It is not like they decide I am over here in war so I will just kill whoever because i can. I am an ex-army wife and people don’t understand what some of these men and their famlies face. Just because you may have been one of the lucky ones that can deal with everything you’ve seen and faced in war don’t judge those who are not so lucky! It changes their very being of who they are and were before being in those situations. Be thankful that you are well and that you do not have to face what you’ve done and hear everyone elses judgments and agianst you and your family for supporting and loving you!! Because they know that is not who you WERE when you left.
“Simply because the people these soldiers killed while in our captivity fought our soldiers[...]”
Alethus… well what in the heck do you think WAR is? If the enemy shoots at us we are supposed to shoot back.. that is WAR. People need to quit comparing what happens in a war to civilian situations.
Murder is commited when you have laws, and you don’t respect them. Should the police officers murder a man in the US simply because he is released whenever they arrest him for lack of proof? Wars are governed by laws just as much as countries are and the mere fact that these low-life radicalist muslims do not go by them does not in any way allow us, american soldiers to do the same. It’s sad because I do deeply believe that these three soldiers meant well by their action, yet it is no excuse for the act they committed, premeditated murder. My best wishes to them and their family, but you always end up paying for your actions sometime in life.
This story breaks my heart. My prayers are with him and his family.
Thank you so much for all you do. I am so glad that John has your love and support. We will continue to do what it takes to see him home soon.
Thank you for staying the course!
Kathyryn Oliverio
Kim,
You are a trooper through this whole thing!! I don’t know if I could handle what is happening to you and John with the dignity the two of you have. You both inspire me to be a better person. I miss the two of you sooo much!! I long to be back in Germany with you and John and the whole 1/18 crew. You made FRG so much fun. I loved the singing! We were a family, so close, and I feel like I’ve left the family. What happened to John is so awful. Chris has never been the same since that tour, he is now undergoing treatment for PTSD and depression after losing so many of his friends. I think if it hadn’t been for John, he would be in morre of a wreck than he originally was. He is getting better but it is a slow process. We are in Colorado Springs now and Chris will be deploying again in the summer. This will be his 4th tour. He idolizes John so much. He’s about to go for his 7 and he keeps telling me that he’s going to be a great platoon sgt. since he had the best training in John. He wants to make him proud. We will do whatever we can to help you and John make this time go by faster. Just let me know how I can help. Oh and I think before he deploys again we will make a trip to visit John. We aren’t that far anymore. I’ll let you know before we do so you can give me the “right” ways to do that.
Kim,
Im so glad you have been able to see John. I hope Tx is treating you well. Schweinfurt is going.. same old same old. LOL.. Dom and I miss both you and John, and we are praying for everything to work out. We miss and love you guys … RIGHT ON!!!!
Having only served with 1SG Hatley for a few months, I truly believe that this is the best 1SG I have ever had the pleasure of serving under. He has done nothing short of helping me understand the principles of leadership and the care of soldiers under my command. I am proud to say that I was part of His Company Alpha Company 1-18 IN (schweinfurt) and I respect everything 1SG did for us as his boys. I can not wait to hear more on 1SG’s Clemency, I hope for the best evry time.
Kim,
I know you won’t remember me, We met on multiple occasions like FRG activities and the battalion balls. My name is Lawrence Gray. I was a Sgt and Team Leader in 1-18 HHC Support Plt. Im now out of the Army but remember how hard 1SG Hatley worked and the Standards he upheld. He IS a GREAT AMERICAN HERO in my eyes as well as all or most of 1-18. I would proudly follow him into battle again as Alpha Co. stood tall and shined for 2nd BCT. Any time that any platoon or squad exchanged fire or was hit by IEDs or was in need of assistance 1sg Hatley and Alpha Co. was there. John Hatley will always stand out in my mind as a leader and the 1SG that took care of his soldiers, and this case is a true travesty. My thoughts and prayers go with you and your family and my deepest respect will always be with 1sg John Hatley.
God bless. SGT Gray
Kim–Your courageous and inspiring campaign to fight the cause for John and the other young men is beyond any one thing that I have ever accomplished in my lifetime. I would be proud to help you out in whatever ways I am able…I am so happy that John still has his indominitable spirit about him. He will always be a rock and inspiration for the other men. It is who he is just as what you are doing is who you are.
God bless–
You friend, Dea
Kim,
Your love for John continues to inspire and awe me. I am so proud of you. May John’s spirit NEVER be broken. Keep fighting … never stop.
ILU.
Trysh
Hi Kim,
What a beautiful website you have constructed. I think it tells the story wonderfully well. You have worked so hard for John and he has kept his spirits up amazingly. I want to tell you what an inspiration the two of you are and that my prayers are with you always!
Keep Fighting!
Kelly and the whole Wells’ family